I guess that was tough to watch, but there were no surprises here. We all know who these guys are and what’s at stake. I don’t care if our candidate was deaf and blind, and couldn’t remember his own name. Here’s my take and I’m sticking with it…
Bravo! Joe Biden has been the best president in my lifetime. He obviously had a bad cold tonight. He’s been working nonstop on domestic and international issues. He was subjected to a malignant narcissist and pathological liar who was allowed to spew incessant falsehoods without fact-checking and without being directed to answer the questions asked. This disaster is solely the responsibility of CNN.
I agree. It wasn't until the second half of the debate that they allowed Biden to finish his time, telling him he had some more minutes left. In the first half of the debate, as soon as Biden finished a thought, they went to Trump! Thus, I'm sure Trump got way more time than Biden. And he used his time to be bully. It simply wasn't fair. And why did they not stop Trump when he was spewing obvious lies! Ask for evidence of some of his outrageous claims! That's what good moderators do.
How is it the moderators fault that Biden did not use his time? You said he finished his thought? So if he was finished why did the moderators have to do his thinking for him? Oh, right because he is senile, got it
Not everyone who is of a certain age is senile and Joe Biden has certainly been very capable of running this country and has done so extremely well with help of course from his advisors like the vast majority of our presidents.
You mean his handlers. He does not even know where he is most of the time. Extremely well? Like record high inflation and record amount of illegals coming across. If that is extremely well, I hope we have less of what you say is well
Bc - when presented the question. Trump didn’t answer - he blathered on about Biden’s previous response -
Ie; Trump was asked if he will round up all immigrants that haven’t had their court case heard or are here illegally and deport them and how will he do that ?
Yes this was a money-making proposition for CNN and the network. I felt that they did a very poor job in not insisting that Trump stick to answering the actual question he is being asked. I believe that had a great deal to do with the disastrous results because Trump just kept telling lie after lie.
This is why the cry for “younger” falls on deaf ears. The “younger” “personalities” on media show the “younger” generation isn’t yet up to the job of handling such serious responsibilities.
It’s delusional to think that someone like a white knight on a horse is going to appear to take Biden‘s place as a candidate. It simply is not going to happen four months before the election. Republican candidates do all kinds of horrid things, and Republicans still stand behind them. Our best bet now is to stand behind Biden, the way Republicans stand behind their convicted felon.
He should make a video in which to present what he’s done for regular people and to counter Trump’s lies, and plaster it all over Tik-tok and elsewhere.
I doubt Trump will agree to a 2nd debate, Janet, at least unless his poll numbers are below Biden's. They will go up after this debate. Performance nearly always outweighs substance in debates in viewers' minds. Trump greatly outperformed Biden, looking strong, forceful & articulate with a superior presence of mind, even if everything he said was pure lies & projection. A major test of this debate was to see which candidate had a sharper mind, & unfortunately Trump won on that account tonight. Very disappointing!
I would say based on the first debate Biden should stay away from further debates. He's just not up to it. Did you see how he could barely walk out on stage? Did you notice how nervous he was and how you could barely hear or understand his words? Did you notice his seeming unability to put Trump in his place on most issues that Trump lied about? It was a bloody massacre. I love Joe, but his physical decline is hard to watch. How can he possibly withstand 4 more years? Did you see the pitiful way Jill Biden tried to be the enthisiasm leader after the debate? How she ledJoe into the waffle house and Joe looked like he could bsrely move/talk, that he was in a daze? I don't wish this for him or the country, but it's true.
What second debate? Trump won this one he's going to take his money and run. There is not going to be another one. I've voted for Democratic presidents ever since George HW Bush but I'm sitting this one out if the Democrats don't do something during the convention because its a lost cause. Lets face it the MAGA's out smarted them.
That's just not true. He called for the debates. He boasted about how it would go. And then he did THAT.
There is no way to make up for THAT.
The debates, themselves, were supposed to make up for ground he lost by demonstrating how deep his racism goes (all the way down to genocide).
Instead of making up some of the support he drove away, he drove away even more support.
Claiming he can "make up for" THAT — at THIS point — is the desperate self-delusion of a gambling addict.
Gambling with American democracy.
Just to preserve one narcissistic geriatric racist, who surrounds himself with yes-men, and ignores the will of the people when it suits him. As if "he alone" can defeat the other narcissistic geriatric racist, who surrounds himself with yes-men, ignores the will of the people, and has been handed a very effective plan to rid himself — and America — of democracy's last scraps.
Not only is Joe Biden not the best man for the job, but I think it's ludicrous, at this point, to presume he's on America's side.
He has a chance, but he is likely to do worse, not better. I predict that if Biden is the nominee, Trump will win. It's not too late to change horses here.
Why is no criticism directed at the convicted felon, who lied for 90 minutes and said that overturning Roe was his "gift" to America? He called America the worst country in the world - Why is there no call for him to step down and for the GOP to find a suitable candidate??
Yesterday, SCOTUS punted the EMTALA case and 2 men argued that women DO NOT HAVE A RIGHT TO LIFESAVING CARE - why are you not making that point and defending us?
To support trump the GOP printed "proud to be a felon" t-shirts and wore diapers for christ's sake!
People need to get a grip and stop wishing for unicorns.
There is no magic white male candidate coming to save the day.
Volunteer every day to turn out the vote and punch back against a lawless authoritarian and his democracy ending Project 2025.
Thanks Marilee. You have nailed it. All these people seeing Biden as a total loss completely have forgotten everything he’s done for this country over the past three years and how he literally brought us back from the brink. It’s rather sad.
Again, you nailed it and I could not agree more. This is apparently a country where superficiality, appearances, and bravado are more important than substance and soul. And that’s a very sad statement about America.
No, this is reality. He does not LOOK like he's up for the job - and that's what's going to matter to swing voters - who will be deciding the election.
People need to realize that the president is NOT running America by himself. Trump may believe that, but the truth is the administration and all of the people appointed there are the runs running America! I will vote for Biden regardless of what happened in the debate. I will NEVER support an outright liar like trump is!
We are also talking about an amazing administration. We have a president who has put together a fantastic team, with very few staff changes, gaining experience that can only benefit the nation even more with another term. We have a president who wants a team, respects his team, and makes decisions with his team. We know the felonious rapist liar is a one-man show. His goals are to keep himself out of prison and grab the rest of America by the p*s*y. That's it. Anybody who doesn't support the blue ticket as it stands now or whatever it becomes is choosing that. No good will come to them or the rest of us. It'll be a new Dark Age.
You can't tell the people what they need to believe Jan, Just like the Democratic Party can't tell the people they should feel good because of Biden's accomplishments.
You make a good point, Jan. A presidency is the sum of the people a president surrounds himself with and the causes and policies they are committed to pormoting and, hopefully, enacting. I would much rather have a Biden White House than a Trump Hell Holel.
Not just America Mike! I'm currently in the UK & while not super surprising, his performance is reverberating here. His recent European trip, i'm afraid, set a tone.....A good man, for sure, but too old, & not up to the rigors & enormity of the job.
Biden's fault for not calling him out, but Trump kept Biden against the ropes with lie after lie, pummeled him, and the moderators let Trump lie, that is the way the "debate" was set up. Trump came on stage belligerent ready for a WWI match, because he was primed to attack, over and over with lies, knowing that he could get away with the act.
The Gish gallop is a rhetorical technique in which a person in a debate attempts to overwhelm their opponent by providing an excessive number of arguments with no regard for the accuracy or strength of those arguments. He lied, and then poured another lie on top of the lie, and then poured half-dozen half-truths and straw-men arguments on top of those lies. It was overwhelming.
Inflation, covid, jobs, foreign policy, January 6th, climate change — every one of Donny’s “answers” followed the same format:
Mine was the greatest. It was the greatest ever. It was great. Everyone said how great it was. the greatest. then he came in and now it’s a disaster. Everyone says it’s a disaster. When I get back in it’s gonna be great again.
REAL TIME moderation was ESSENTIAL!!!
CNN, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash should all dig a hole, jump into it and pull it closed over themselves. What they perpetrated last night was journalistic infamy.
I think if Gary Newsome came forward now, or Jamie RASKIN, the Dems would have a landslide victory. It isn’t too late. Let’s do the practical thing. Joe is not going to make it through four more years, and Kamala hasn’t made enough of a good impression on people to be a popular choice.
The Republicans have changed the game while we Dems live by the old, plodding rules of decency. It is time to shake the box. I refuse to live under a fascist Trump regime. Let's go ballistic and switch to a new candidate. Who? I would support Jamie Raskin (not Newsome) because he is a constitutional scholar, super smart and can be aggressive as hell....
Why? Because she's the wrong colour or the wrong gender? Frankly, from over here in europe, its dazzlingly obvious that the Reps are arseh*les, and choosing that bloated pig as their leader is INSANE!!
I would vote for Raskin in a heartbeat. Make him the VP candidate and shift Harris to AG to replace the weak and ineffectual Garland. But given the corruption and suicidal tendencies of the DNC gang, this is not likely to happen.
Democrats who wish for the Shiny New Penny are delusional. Joe Biden continues to be a remarkably effective president. He had a bad debate night. That's all. The other guy incessantly trash-talked our country and blatantly lied. I'm contributing money to the Biden-Harris campaign today. I don't need a shiny new penny. I like the looks of my Old Silver Dollar.
Biden has been a great president!! If he were brain dead he would be would still be great. Unfortunately, elections are not decided based on facts, policies, or accomplishments. There is only one explanation as to why the polls are close. As the tRump's have argued it is all about strength vs weakness. If facts mattered this election would be no contest, but the perceived image is all that matters. The candidate bases are unshakable. Any voter who is undecided thinks tRump is despicable and Biden is too old. Undecided? Proof facts are irrelevant. Perceived image is all that matters and facts are irrelevant.
If that were the case, then why did Biden win by a large margin in 2020? Because people are sick of Trump, and he’s only gotten worse since then. Now suddenly all those folks are going to embrace him? I have a hard time believing that millions of people are going to flock back to Trump. That thought helps keep me sane. I hope I am right.
The Felon is a bully, a thug and a pathological liar.
I won't be bullied by his lies. After the debate, I went to the Biden-Harris campaign website and made a contribution. I hope that others will respond to the disgusting river of lies in similar fashion.
I agree and when I hear some of these news outlets especially right after the debate saying how Joe Biden should step down but then they don't really have any idea who would take his place. They all run Kamala Harris into the ground because of their claims that she is so unpopular and that might be true for some but not all. Do I think that she would be capable of taking over should something happen to Joseph Biden? Yes I absolutely do think that she is more than capable and I am sick and tired of what is not said and that is because she is a woman and obviously a woman of color.
Don't be so pessimistic, Janet. Who will have the courage to step up and run against Biden to get the Dem nomination? Biden has early dementia. Time to replace him.
I was thinking maybe Hillary Clinton. She was very popular last time she ran. I also like Gavin Newsome, but he might be too liberal. It breaks my heart to think the Dems may be hanging out to dry, with no alternate candidate who can trounce the evil-doer, Trump. There is no joy in Mudville today.
No! Everything I hear from her turns me off, and she just supported an AIPAC fave over progressive Jamaal Bowman, who wasn't the sharpest operative but who is a decent guy, from all I can see.
If I remember correctly, even President Obama had a terrible first debate against Mitt Romney. He made up for it in the second debate and he won. We can come back from this. We have no choice but to try. There needs to be some shake-up in the Biden communications team, and I hope Jill Biden has a role in bringing that about.
Obama did. He learned from it, & he has great oratory skills that can be useful in a debate. Biden is hampered by his stuttering, his tendency to get flustered & difficulty in completing a thought.
I don’t think he has difficulty in completing a thought; I think he had a really bad cold, and they were unable to postpone the debate because it would not look good if he had done that. We are in an unfortunate situation where millions of Americans are superficial assholes. I can’t control that these feeble-minded people will vote for a lying, narcissistic maniac because he appears forceful. I can’t predict what Biden‘s team or the DNC is going to do, but I don’t think anyone is going to step up to take Biden‘s place, so all this debating about replacing him is time wasted. His team needs to really take the gloves off and do something. I’m not a Democratic strategist, so I’m not sure what that is, but they need to get their act together.
Janet, you are correct. I just turned 72 & have a very bad cold. I've been in 4 NJ Governor's Cabinets & have been an Adjunct Professor at Columbia for 11 years now. I'm pretty sharp, but with this cold, I can barely juggle one ball right now. Unfortunately, perception is reality, and Joe Biden - who is an amazing President and public servant - looked old and feeble. That is what people now see and believe. Is that fair, no but it is reality.
Making excuses doesn't help Janet. I am thinking of parents called into the Principals office, who make excuses for the kids bad behavior, not the Joe's behavior is bad, but we have to face facts, he walks like he has arthritis, can't keep his balance, and talks unconvincingly and hesitantly. He is not animated or loquacious, and he did stumble up the steps of AF One
The problem is the public. Biden may be all substance, but Trump is all style, as obnoxious as it is, even though a convicted felon, the public goes for style over substance.
In 2020 his obnoxious behavior during the debate did him in,it was not presidential (style), in 2024 his behavior has been normalized as has his lies.
Obama is too thoughtful and polite. Doesn't work well in our present environment. Remember Reality TV, competition, conflict are the life blood of America.
You don't win in war, games or politics by playing by the rules, you don't win by being on the defense, you don't win by being polite and considerate. You don't win by being smarter than the other guy either, you win by being ruthless, in politics, business, stock market
Unfortunately, the places where Biden is more solid than Obama don't seem to count. On the other hand, I just got something pushing Michelle Obama, who may have Ivy League degrees, but hasn't ever worked in politics.
I love your heart and your spirit but I am afraid that the next one, if there is one, Joe will fare worse. He will watch this performance and be quite saddened by who he appeared to be. I know in his mind he sees himself as he was, I do as well but when I shave I know better. Joe needs to shave.
At the outset the visuals were wrong. Biden walks on stage stiff legged. Then Trump charges on exhibiting angry and hyper aggression.
Trump dominated, he lied,lied, lied and there was no fact checking by the moderator, he manages to spew 20 lies within the time allotted, and put Biden on the defense. You aren't going to win anything on the defense.
In the first 20 or 30 minutes, Joe tries to defend himself and loses his train of thought, stumbles, and at that point the pain was so much that I turned off the TV.
Yes Trump lied and lied and lied, he was his usual hyper aggressive self and all Biden could do was say "that's a lie".
For the good of democracy, for the good of the Republic, Joe should step aside, but if he does the way the Democratic party is organized that will mean Kamala will be the nominee, and she is just as weak in confrontation and debate as Biden.
It is not a matter of loyalty, of honesty,of goodness, of empathy, or gender it is a matter of saving Democracy. And Saturday nights Biden won't do.
The committed won't change their minds because of the debate. I certainly won't. I'd vote Biden if he crawled on stage and mumbled, anything but Trump. But not so for the millions of fence sitters., and those that don't pay attention to what is going on in the landscape,much less politics.
Unfortunately there is no race horse in the Democratic stable, that has been groomed, and that is why we got Biden in 2020, not to mention 2024.
I've said it before, I'll say it again Biden did not win the election, Trump lost. 81 million people showed up to clean out the 'Aegean stable and return an Offal Office to an Oval Office
It is not the candidate that is the problem it is the party. They had their chance in 2016, when they redid the Democratic party, instead of new leadership, they put Tom Perez, and establishment hack in charge.
The Republican party favors demagogic right wing populists that appeal to baser instincts, the Democratic party favors bland, non threatening milquetoasts, who don't threaten the donor class.. What we need are fired up, energetic left wing populists of the the Bernie Sanders class. Not Bernie he is too old, among other problems.
Fight fire with fire.
I agree with Janet below. It's too late to change horses, but worse there are no horses to replace the horse they are riding.
The DNC should have been grooming Gretchen Whitmer or Gavin Newsom, but in 2020 they pulled a tired old race horse from the paddock and put him in the starting gate, and he only one because the other horse hobbled himself
Kamala Harris did quite well in her debate with Mike Pence in 2020, and she has a solid track record as AG and senator of California. Were she white.....
I agree, as I said in a subsequent post, If Kamala were to head the ticket after the Democratic National convention in Aug, she would start with 226 electoral votes from Democrat and Democrat leaning states.
Mi, PA and WI have 45 electoral votes, and Kamala is not hindered by the anti Biden Muslim and black sentiment that Biden has in those states. that give her 271 votes, and she wins.
I was one who favored Biden stepping down before he announced he was running again. That would have been the time to do it, because he said even during his initial campaign that he was a transitional president. Then he changed his mind and decided he wanted four more years. The DNC went along with that. Now, four months before the election, I don’t know how you shove a new candidate in front of the public. I think that will make the Democratic Party seem even weaker. Just like the Republicans stand up for their malignant narcissist of a convicted felon, I think we need to stand up for our candidate and move forward, and stop all this ruminating about what could or should have been.
Janet: I am with you, however I think it was the DNC that asked Biden to run,simply because they don't have any race horses warming up in the paddock, much less in the stable.
For a horse to be brought to the starting gate in the DNC, it must first have the approval of the "owners" (the donor class, then it must have the right credentials, and prove that it is well trained and obedient to the whip.
I kept tabs of how many times Bill Clinton sang the praises of "international financial institutions" (21 times in his speeches, there in lies a clue, that and the fact that when he left office, penniless, save for Hillary's advance on her book, he was gifted his own non profit, The Clinton Global Initiative, which provided him a nice executive salary.
The threat to the donor class, the money powers, comes from young blood, the progressives, they are change agents who appeal to the masses. The DNC's fear of change, opened the door for Trump, who promised change, even though that change was regressive.
Change from the status quo can be regressive or progressive. 40% of America or better is for regressive change..Back to the Future.
A six month in-depth investigation into what obligations both men have been committed to and have accomplished would be very enlightening to help explain their performances tonight.
Nope. The fainthearts need to step down and let the Braveheart steady on. I mean, how fickle must one be to abandon a good WORLD leader over a headcold?
Agreed. Gutless, piss-poor moderating. They should have cut off the mics (and ideally applied an electric shock) the instant one of the contestants deviated from answering the question or tried to go back and argue a previous topic.
The moderators were terrible; it was obvious that President Biden was sick, and nothing was done to refute Trump’s lies. Future debates should be cancelled.
It's a maxim in cold contact sales that if a sale is to be made, it'll be made within the first 30 seconds contact with the prospective customer, while the debates have become glorified "infomercials." If the prospective customer is persuaded to buy your product, they'll be persuaded to buy from >you< and be interested in hearing more of what you have to say about the product. If they're not persuaded to buy from you, nothing else you can possibly say about your product will matter and will probably just annoy whoever you're trying to pitch - who may or may not listen politely to your pitch and >then< tell you to get lost.
Apply that thinking to any commercial you've ever seen or may ever see. Now, consider last night's debate as a "live commercial," sort of like there were live commercials in early TV. Now evaluate each participant based on their first 30 seconds. That is what the public saw; that's the product the public may or may not buy - particularly in any clips (commercials) drawn from the debate. That's for >you< to judge.
I switched programs after about 15 minutes because I already knew exactly what the backwash would be. Besides, I >already know< everything both participants could possibly say in the debate, and what they'll continue to say until November. It's all been in our collective faces for >months and months! < Just sayin'.
A LITTLE WHILE LATER: Biden seems to have made up for his debate showing in an NC rally: https://youtu.be/s5CVZHAjrW8?si=HVI3s5gUsje220N- (Although I could suspect he's employing lessons learned from ol' Schitzinpantz's rallies. Then again, it shows he still learns from experience.)
I just wish >that< Biden could've shown up in the debate.
It's a long way to November in a contest where a week is an infinity.
Perhaps you're right. But I remain skeptical of the US public these days. Evidence? No. Only a question: "How is it that we have come to this juncture?"
I can’t explain the main reason why we are at this perilous juncture, but there are many aggrieved people who somehow think that a bully like Trump is going to save them. All I know is that Trump was rejected soundly in 2020, and I hope those same folks, especially women, vote in huge numbers.
I couldn’t agree more. I was appalled by their allowing T to avoid answering questions and lying about whatever he chose to address. Particularly upsetting was the claim he made about some states even “permitting “ post birth abortions, whatever that means.
Last time I watch CNN! The moderators were a disaster and didn't even try to fact check anything that Trump said. True that Biden did not sound good 😕 but he is like the ordinary worker who does not abuse their paid time off and is reliable and trustworthy
Chris Matthews on MSNBC said it best. 2 Jobs and they are very different. BEING President requires great leadership and teamwork. Biden is outstanding. Running for President requires Great Communication skills. Bidens have surely slipped at least for last night they did.
I agree, but i feel sick that this fascist is going to destroy the free world. Trump was well prepared with his lies and ad hominem attacks; Joe just looked like a quiet victim softly stating facts, which Trump simply called lies. I’m not happy with a country or a people who would elect such a simple monster. This is the result of a deficit in our educational system and propaganda courtesy of social media. I feel like I want to fight, but I don’t know who to hit.
Unfortunately, you are right, Cheryl. I coulnd't watch it after the first few minutes. It was so painful. Where to go now, though? I would support, Hillary, Newsom and Jamie Raskin. Who do you think might be a good alternative to Biden?
Any of those and others—Hakeem Jeffries, Gov Whitmer, etc. The Democrats have a lot of talent. I respect Biden enormously and think he has done an exceptional job the last four years, especially in the context of an assault on our democracy by a bunch of rabid, psychopathic jackals. That said, Biden’s disastrous performance last night added large crashing cymbals to the corporate media’s relentless, “he’s-too-old” drumbeat—a drumbeat that even prior to the debate had Biden trailing in the polls despite being one of the better presidents—ever. The problem is not Biden’s lack of substance; it’s his seeming struggle to communicate it—a struggle that last night morphed into a tragic inability to do so. Whether Biden’s deer-in-the-headlights performance was due to a cold, poor debate strategy, or a debate format that seemed to favor the ex-liar-in-chief doesn’t matter, because it unfortunately supported the unfortunate narrative that Joe’s too old.
Yes, Cheryl. I agree with you on those alternatives to Biden also. And you are right about everything else you say. It is so sad. Now, we have more to fear than ever that Trump may actually become president again, and that is a truly scary thought given everything we know about him already and everything he has indicated he will do if he is president again. I like to say Trump belongs in the Big House instead of the White House. If only it were so. :(
Hey QAnon wants their talking points back. If we used popular vote then California and New York would elect all our presidents and we would be in as bad a shape as those two states. But since the process does not depend on popular vote but with the electoral college (you know the one that the left loves to defend if it goes their way) then you post is pointless.
President Biden has Parkinson's Disease. I have held my tongue for weeks now, in the hope that someone in his entourage would have him see a doctor who knows what he's doing. Parkinson's, along with its almost invevitable concomitant of REM sleep disorder, can make a patient look frail and confused during the day.
The sad thing is, for Biden and the country, that this is a highly treatable condition in its early stages, and Biden could do well for many more years.
Now it's too late.
As Sir Leopold Amery famously said to Neville Chamberlain 84 years ago, "In the name of God, go!"
Indeed. I have some personal experience with someone who suffers from Parkinson’s. She’s 82, and was diagnosed in 2019. The downward slope of her progression through this disease has been dramatic. In the past 2 years she has become wheelchair bound, and is beginning to now show many signs of dementia. Biden’s gait and his demeanor do seem consistent with Parkinson’s, but I’m not a medical professional. He should be treated by a qualified neurologist to make that call, and if he is indeed suffering from Parkinson’s, hopefully he’ll realize he should step aside. I’ll say this though… the person I know, didn’t want to give up driving, or walking, or anything else she used to take for granted. We had to draw the line for her. Getting old sucks.
My father was diagnosed with Parkinson's along with Lew Body's dementia. His symptoms started out as irritability & neglect of normal activities & obligations. He went downhill quickly in the last 2-3 years & couldn't do anything by himself towards the end.
I'm a retired RN with 35+years of experience in acute and critical care. I also think Joe Biden has Parkinson's and treatment is critical. Symptoms include flat affect, vacant stare,shuffling gait and tremors. His left hand was shaky during the debate. He exhibits all of these. How can he maintain for 4.5 more years? No need to list what's wrong with the "other guy"
I'll stand in the rain to vote for Biden, however we will all lose. Biden simply cannot be the Democrat nominee, or the world will be plunged into a new horror show, the like of which hasn't been seen for 85 years.
It is. Without treatment he would be worse. I am a physician but have not examined Biden, so I offer an educated guess only. Whatever, we need a younger qualified democratic candidate.
Why does he have to maintain it for 4.5 years? Why can't he get elected, pick a strong team, and keep going? And let the succession plan work the way it's supposed to work?
Clinically it's so obvious, and I didn't expect it to take so long to make the diagnosis. Not just his gait, but the blunting of facial expression, the unblinking stare, the poverty of movement, the soft voice. Above all, his confusion is not dementia, but the likely result of REM sleep disorder, a highly treatable condition.
His medical advice has been just appalling, and his doctor should have been dismissed long ago.
Assuming he has had this condition, untreated, for 2-3 years, his prognosis is good, on treatment, for several more years.
Now it's too late. For the sake of himself, his party, and above all the country and the world, he has to go.
At least this is a very valid medical reason for having him bow out, & a great excuse for replacing him. Do you have any medical credentials along with your compelling argument that would make it useful for you to try to persuade some people in high positions of power that Biden has Parkinson's & should be replaced?
Look, he has parkinsonism, and he either has the common treatable form, or an untreatable variant. Either way, it's too late now for his political career, and he has to bow out.
Oh, it does? What do you think of Biden's current VP choice? Why don't you SAY HER NAME? And why don't you openly discuss the concerns you may have about his current choice? Woman? Indian? Black? Prosecutor? Experience? What are your opinions about the current succession plan?
This is just insidious doubt-mongering. WHO are you anyway, to diagnose the man?
To steady the nation’s nerves at this juncture, and really wake things up, I’d like to see Obama as Biden’s vice-presidential running mate. He can supply the vigor and resilience necessary, and his experience would allow him to back up Biden to any extent needed or wanted. I don’t think it’s a banned choice, and there’s no one else I can think of in the country who could provide that experience and backup right now.
Thank you for bringing this to our attention. If his team knows this, it’s absolutely shameful that they did not bring it to public attention and look for a new candidate. This is the first I've heard of it, and what I’ve been hearing from various channels is that he walks that way because of arthritis. If the president knows this and didn’t step down of his own accord, then he has really done us a disservice.
He may have arthritis, but that's not his main problem. I feel so sad about the situation. He's a very good president, and, in my opinion, has had very poor medical attention.
Of course, if he has resisted the diagnosis, and has refused treatment, then that is just appalling also.
I suspect he has PD and it is being treated. He does not show signs of dementia, but he is too old for another 4 years. Trump would be worse. We need a new Democratic candidate.
Perhaps. But I think it more likely that he has advanced arthritis and/or degenerative disk/bone disease. That would be more in keeping with what we have been told. My Mother had this and she became so stiff she could barely get around; pain was constant and required much pain killers, which became harder to get. His speech issue has been life-long, but has gotten noticeably worse. He knows the facts and has good reasoning, but it doesn't cone out well under pressure, and his annunciation has gotten worse. He is still the better candidate by far.
He seemed much better when he appeared at the watch party after the debate. He also seemed to improve as the debate went on. My wife suspects a cold medication.
Jeepers! Biden is a decent and responsible guy. If he’s been diagnosed with PD I feel confident he’d bow out. I sense some “mob rule” here - not one of the comments is coming from anyone who has actually examined the President or who has access to his medical records. Slow down all the rumor-mongering please.
I’ve seen plenty of recent clips where he’s doing fine. He’s an old guy, true, but he’s OUR guy!
You don't think his doctors would know this if it were true, and he wouldn't be being treated for it? Didn't he have a physical recently and was declared okay?
The GOP has been dismantling our education system for decades, and have been assisted by the bleeding hearts. They have removed art, music, civics, and the far left insisted "everyone wins a prize," teach math 3 different ways because different children learn differently, and nobody gets lower than a "B" for a passing grade.
The dumber we get, the more honor roll students there seem to be!
If you want to fight, reach out to your local Democratic Town/City/County Committee. They have things you can do that will actually help - and you won't get arrested for assaulting anyone! LOL!
Have you ever watched your child year after year sit alone on a cafeteria floor after almost all the kids went up to the stage to get an award? I did and it was heart wrenching!
I have a child who is beautiful and amazing and was diagnosed incorrectly with a behavioral disorder in our wonderful AZ schools. She was never a problem child, but couldn't get good grades and prefered reading all the time. This diagnosis placed her in classrooms with kids who really struggled emotionally. She was finally diagnosed correctly at 16yo with autism in Wyoming.
When we moved to Washington, she was placed into an alternarive high-school that helped my daughter to graduate at 20yo. She didn't get awards for math or science excellence, but she was acknowledged for the skills she did have; elegance, diplomacy, empathy, compassion, and love of music and art. She was made to feel needed and important.
Now she is 26yo, getting the services she needs and going to college. She is deeply aware of politics and people. She is studying to be an ESL teacher because she is really good at languages and cultures and likes working with immigrants.
I was a conservative, but having worked with "far-left" people who brought my daughter out of her shell and made her a big shiny pearl is a gift that keeps on giving to this mom whose daughter used to ask me why she was so stupid, couldn't do anything right, and couldn't make her teachers happy.
Sit and ponder on that before you ignorantly attack professionals who are in the thankless but honorable work of fighting for all children's rights to prosper and flourish!
I'm sorry you're child was misdiagnosed. Two of my children are on the spectrum and I am grateful for programs that have helped make them wonderful, positive. contributing members of society. I also have 3 teachers, a school nurse and a guidance counselor in my family. I listen to them complain that they are given "directives" that if a student shows up for class, regardless if they are prepared or not, if they do work or not, they get a "B;" this is not for the child, this is to avoid issues with the parents who provide no accountability for their child and refuse to accept their child is not perfect. Teachers have been assaulted by parents, heck, teachers have been assaulted by students and parents have defended the students' actions as justified!
We are both speaking anecdotally, and while the left helped your daughter, I watched one of my other children be given math papers back with wrong answers marked correct; when I approached the teacher, she explained to me, that it was a subtraction paper, and although the answer was wrong, it was smaller, so my child understood it was "less than." Sorry, that may be an "A" for effort, but not an "A" in math.
Yep giving everyone a trophy is the best course of action. That way those who worked hard and got the good grades will notice that it did not matter and they might as well give up. Yep your answer is much better
Your response is just plain cruel. It's also way off base. People work hard and get good grades for intrinsic reasons, not for 'trophies'. Please learn something before spouting off your nonsense.
You have a sprawling Department of Education started by the incompetent peanut farmer and a special interest group called the Teachers Union run by a far-left wack-o that puts teachers before students and parents and you blame the GOP for dismantling the education system? DEI, CRT, boys in girls bathrooms....you've shot yourselves in the foot and have the temerity to call the GOP the villain?
Absolutely! god forbid teachers use creativity to educate children. They think teachers should teach from a book, and students learn from a book. No need to go to a symphony concert, art museum, a local business to see how things are made, a living history museum, historical play, a french restaurant, or an aquarium (a few places I went on field trips as a student). By stressing out teachers and terrifying children with threats of being held back if they fail, those tests can take some credit for contributing to our "Anxiety Generation."
I find it insulting people who bash educators have no training in education. Many feel it is all someone else's fault. Most likely, it everyone worked together the child and parents would have it easier. When children don't have an easy time learning or are different blame is placed on teachers and school. People need to just work together because no one caused this. Work together and stop blaming helpers.
There's plenty of blame to go around. I pointed out cutting programs and classes - that's what the right has done. The left has done it's share, and I pointed that out too.
Funny that you say Republicans have cut classes yet I live in Idaho (a very Republican state) and the kids have all those classes that you listed. What they don’t have is drag queen hour.
That's right, in Idaho there are no "drag queens." All you cowboys save your "non-conforming" sexuality for when you go on your Brokeback mountain excursions. either that, or you prove you're not gay by beating up young gay men and tying them onto barbed wire fences, leaving them to die like Matthew Shepard. Oh wait, those are both Wyoming - it's in Idaho where people believe that homosexuals have their sex organs in their mouths (cited source below). Have you ever been to a drag queen story time? These people are actors who read these stories with passion and inflection and personality that draws young children in and gets them involved in the stories. It doesn't make them gay; it makes them great listeners and early learners.
Find a common ground with your MAGA friend if any. Biden came up short with the end of our war in Afghanistan and with an unconstitutional inflationary attempt to forgive student loan debts. The
moveothe discussion o the greater reasons Biden is better despite his age and disability.
I totally agree and feel the same way. That there are actually millions of people in our country who support - and seem to worship - a loathesome individual, a convicted felon, and a person who has spelled out all of the evil and vengeful, not to mention, dangerous things he will do (regarding relations with Russian, support for our allies and our commitment to help Ukraine), is so appalling, it's beyond understanding.
Of course the message is good. We can keep saying that until we’re blue in the face. For a long time, it hasn’t been about that. It’s about our messenger. It takes both—in fact, history shows a good messenger is the most important thing if you want to WIN.
Good grief, woman! Open your eyes and ears and listen to what people are saying! Why Biden’s doctors aren't getting Biden the care he needs is unforgivable. Unless old Joe won't allow them to. WE ARE A PARTY WITHOUT A HEALTHY, HARDY MESSENGER, AND AS SUCH, BIDEN IS DOING THIS NATION A REAL WRONG! HE IS LEAVING US STRANDED AND UP A CREEK WITHOUT SO MUCH AS A CANOE! I HAVE BEEN SCREAMING AT THIS GROUP SINCE THE BEGINNING OF MY JOINING THAT BIDEN WAS A NON-STARTER! BURYING ONE'S HEAD IN THE SAND HAS GOTTEN US TO WHAT WE WITNESSED TONIGHT!
I agree, like men dressing like women to get into girls locker rooms and bathrooms and to be able to read to little kids. Yes we have heard the message loud and clear
Oh Brad, I love your white male confidence to jump into a conversation about something else and vomit hate all over the place. Pretty on brand. Me thinks you may be a power bottom that is just self hating or wanting to wear some of those women's clothes?
And in just 5 words Mary, you've distilled the choice that's in front of us! For sure, they're both old, but one of them has well defined clinical pathology, & the other, he wants to help American's live a better life.
Hi Jamie, I can’t handle the animosity on these threads in this particular newsletter. I am going to shut down for the day. All the screaming and shouting about replacing Biden is not going to get us anywhere. The wise thing to do would’ve been to step down as he indicated he planned to do after four years. Then he changed his mind. It is quite possible that most of America did not watch this debate. The problem is that the news media is going to spin this against Biden in a big big way, and they are our worst enemy and an enemy of democracy.
Biden should have stepped down. He's accomplished a lot, but the truly noble act would have been to at least a year out help another great presidential team get ready to run and act.
I was saddened and stunned by Biden last night, expecting to see a performance equal to his State of the Union. Where was his tan? He looked wan and blank.
But it hasn’t lessened my support or resolve because many of us know that this choice isn’t between Biden and Trump but what they stand for.
VOTE BLUE, to save us, to reinforce democracy, our precious freedoms and civil rights.
Amen! I am with you. I would vote for Biden if he were 500 years old, over the evil-doer Trump. However, will that make a majority? We are in perilous times, for sure.
I was stunned last night, expecting the Biden from the State of the Union. It was sad and painful to watch.
Having said that, you are right, and my resolve to support the Democratic ticket is as strong as ever because our lives and way of life are at stake. My concern is all the many voters who are ambivalent about the two; their choice could doom our country.
Remember, the choice is between democracy and autocracy. Vote straight BLUE to save ourselves, future generations and our country.
This is the same mentality that has brought us to the debate we just witnessed. The continued sponsorship of two lesser evils still leaves us with evils. They say democracy dies in darkness. But what could be darker than the cloth being pulled over your eyes regarding who is running our country at the moment. Biden might be signing the checks, but who’s holding his hand at the time? And your list of false equivalents does nothing to help either side face the issues this country is facing. Did you even read the quotes Richard posted? You are the embodiment of the “public” who hasn’t been allowed to cool off and think clearly. Biden lies. Biden chooses war. Biden spreads division. But because Biden is doing it, you’re ok with it… because he’s “your guy”. Everyone needs to step outside their echo chambers and think critically about what is being done. When Trump was in office, he was excoriated for wanting to close the southern border. He was vilified for raising tariffs, by both the left and independents. But now Biden has finally done both those things and has been praised for it. A bad idea is a bad idea, no matter who does it. I’m not commenting on borders or tariffs as good or bad. I’m saying, blind faith isn’t faith. You can’t blindly follow “your guy” just because he’s not the “other guy”.
I'm sorry you feel this way, but I fully understand why. There is a great deal of truth and logic to what you said, and I concur with much of it - but what are we to do? These, indeed, are times that try our souls. I don't know about you, but I'm standing on a precipice, fighting a howling wind to stay alive. It is hard to sleep, eat, and stay healthy these days. Both candidates are far from acceptable but for extremely different reasons. There is no moral equivalency despite Biden's shortcomings. But Erica, there are times when pragmatism is more important than a genuinely righteous result. We cannot afford to let perfection be the enemy of good. I know there are better outcomes - but are they even remotely achievable in the time left given the damnable complexities of our current election system (is, electoral college, endless dark money, gerrymandering, etc.? You cant govern if you don't win. For what it's worth, my bottom line is this: its not about Biden or Trump anymore. They are inadequate placeholders in a nightmare election. But after what the most corrupt SCOTUS in history has done, we are no longer a democracy. We are a dictatorship and the only chance we have to survive this horror and save our children future at this moment is to commit to vote for Biden or his replacement on Nov. 5. Its democracy or dictatorship and right now dictatorship is winning. These are desperate times. I share your deep concerns and sense of doom. All we can do now is select the candidate that has the greatest chance of stopping Trump and if we prevail, then the truly hard work to renew and fix this damaged and dysfunctional nation begins. If Trump wins. Something that will never be possible again if Trump becomes the monarch SCOTUS has enabled him to be.
That's really overly simplistic. We already knew that Trump is unfit to be president, but unfortunately now we know that Biden is also unfit. Let's convince Biden to withdraw and find a new Dem candidate.
Agreed. But the question isn't who you or I will vote for, it is who will swing voters in the few deciding states vote for? How many potential Democratic voters will stay home due to lack of enthusiasm and not vote at all? That is what Biden's poor physical condition and debate showing has now put in jeopardy.
What is funny is that if a Trump supporter said this he is part of a cult, but when a Biden supporter says it, it is just fine. This is called a double standard which leftist are good at
Yes using the leftist standard you are in a cult. Unless you want to now change the definition of cult. Very possible since any time a leftist wants to do so thing they change the meaning of a word.
Funny how I simply used your sides standard and you don’t like it. But that is usual. The left never likes having their insane standards used against them
Very well said! Yet, this list of words/choices will be perceived as gibberish to MAGAheads whose ability to comprehend anything other than what comes out of their fearless leader’s poisonous little mouth. For them, Trump’s lies are the only things they believe and put their money behind. Nevertheless, those of us with intact grey matter must continue a good fight to maintain our democracy. VOTE BLUE!
You were right to be worried Robert. We now have a 100-alarm fire and the DNC and beltway insiders seem still to be sleep-walking to a massive defeat… Those of us not in the inner elite circles feel so powerless and unheard.
He would eviscerate Trump in a debate, but it is too late for that. And California has issues right now, as we both know. Newsom is not in a strong position. Whitmer is a better choice. Meanwhile, they've sidelined Kamala so badly, she could never get the support she would need. They created an utter mess and our nation will pay for it.
I'm not sure, but Pa. is not California or NJ. And, they love him there, and it's a must-win state for the Ds. I didn't think this country was ready for a Black President either.
Harris wasn't able to garner enough votes in the 2020 election on her own before becoming the VP running mate. She'd be steamrollered, and imo not convinced she's presidential material in any event. Don't like how she gave "Mr. Foreclosure" Steven Mnuchin a pass instead of prosecution back when CA's AG.
That's not what I hear. As I see it, his candidate profile includes Executive experience, well spoken, intelligent, charismatic and Kennedy-esque appeal. His only downside is that CA is not a swing state. However, that didn't stop Nixon and Reagan from the WH. Why do you say GN is not Prez material?. IMO, nobody is perfect... Except MI Gov Gretchen Whitmer.
Newsom, like trump is a self interested, what's in it for me politician, he is also inclined to take the advice of the last man who spoke to him, much like the old King Stephen of England. A good choice is an intelligent well informed politician of any gender with the intelligence and concern for the common god above all else.
You’re kidding right? I’m a Californian and I wish Gavin would have run. Anyone who already hates California and Newsom for no good reason is never voting Blue anyway.
Fay, tRump is presidential material? Biden's base is not going anywhere. Undecided voters will wake up to the fact that not voting or voting for a third party is a vote for tRump. And if they are bought into "the lesser of two evils" BS the lesser is Biden!! For those of us who follow politics find it unfathomable that the likes of a tRump could garner the support he does, which is a damning commentary on the American electorate
No trump is not and never will be presidential material That was exactly why the Federalist Society and Heritage Foundation chose him. There are certain people in any society who love clowns and even I will admit that trump is nothing if not a clown - not as good as Emmet Kelly - but still a clown. I got the biggest laugh last night when he talked about acing the two cognitive tests - they were cognition at the sixth grade level - big whopping wow. I'd place his real IQ between 90 and 110 - within the rank of average intelligence.
Both Newson and CA are hated, literally reviled, in the heartland. Seen as the epitome of unctuous Dem elite. Gretchen Whitmer has won by double digits in MI. Not sure why that political effectiveness and ability to connect with swing voters isn’t the primary consideration?
California is certainly not held in esteem on the East Coast, who equate California with Hollywood (which I personally experienced when traveling the East Coast on business assignments) - trust me there's a lot more to my State than Los Angeles County, which I personally avoid.
Newsom isn't hated. And he is not a "bad" man in the sense that trump is a "bad" man. He is not Presidential material, because he is more self interested than common good interested.
From what I have seen and heard I think Gretchen Whitmer is a good politician. I'm not sure American are willing to give up their macho cowboy image they so crave. Kamala Harris would probably be better suited to the Presidency with her terrific background and experience plus the invaluable training she has received from Joe Biden. But Kamala has two strikes against her - gender and skin color whereas Gretchen only has gender.
lol actually it comes down too Pete has done nothing to warrant anyone voting for him. I guess someone who is a mayor of a little town that can’t even fill pot holes would be better for the Dems than the senile old man running now
My thoughts turned to Mitch Landrieu and Cory Booker. Both showed outstanding leadership as mayors of big cities with big problems. But there are many other possibilities.
Ugh… Thinkum Pocahontas needum go back to teepee, drinkum more firewater & stealum more wampum from young Native American kids trying to get intoum good colleges…
Isn't VP Harris part of the the "campaign apparatus?" She's wouldn't be my first choice, but she's light years better than Trump, and if she had a running mate, like Joaquin Castro, they could bring back the Black and Latino voters who are sliding toward Trump. I do think it's too late for Gavin Newsom, no matter what one might think of him, though as a Californian I think he'd otherwise be just fine.
That's not how campaigns work. The payroll is handled out of campaign coffers and needs to be set up via specific legal processes. Thousands of people need to be hired, given background checks, and put into offices. A candidate cannot just take over someone else's campaign staff and offices, and phone bills, and ....
It's a HUGE undertaking, and has to be done at both state and federal levels. It takes months.
Just campaigning would be absurdly difficult. Getting to all 50 states in 18 weeks would be hard, but that would only give one campaign rally per state. Candidates need to campaign multiple times, at different times of day, in different cities, on weekdays and weekends, in order to make sufficient outreach to enough voters in a state. That can't happen with the time available.
Ballots are already printed in some places, and those would have to be re-done, but I guarantee that the GOP fight, hard, prevent them from being updated (like they did - successfully - in the NH primary) and that would result in the new candidate not even being on the ballot.
There are hundreds or thousands of ways that it's simply not going to work to try to get a new candidate on the ballot now.
I would have preferred someone else as a candidate. I preferred someone else in 2020, too. But we're beyond the point where we can switch candidates, now, strictly from a logistical standpoint.
That is a big fat lie. I live here, and gee, California has not been "run into the ground." And, Sally O'Brien is correct. This is not the time or place to argue about Newsom.
No, it is not. A budget swing from around 100 billion in the black to around 45 billion in the red in one year, billions spent on the homeless problem with no accountability or improvement, lax laws and lack of enforcement leading to a significant crime problem, excessive taxation, highest gas prices in the nation, and the hypocrisy of his behavior during the pandemic. He is a pure politician - nothing more.
If the Democratic party had recognized that Biden was going to be too old to run again and had begun promoting legitimate alternative candidates years ago, there would not be a need to debate alternatives at this point.
Considering we have been saying that long before he ran the first time. But if he comes out the second time and does even a tiny bit better than he did this time your party will have amnesia and rally behind him again
I like Newsom. We also have to realize that our candidate has to battle not just Trump, but the entire Christofascist plot to end our democracy. Our current enemies are legion, but I’ll name some of them: Leonard Leo, chairman of the Federalist Society, and mentor to the six Reich-wing, religiously fanatic activists currently on the Supreme Court, and co-author of Project 2025, and the Heritage Foundation, co-author of Project 2025.
Totally agree with you, Erik. I would vote for Newsom also. He could trounce Trump in a debate and hopefully excite enough of the Dems and uncommitted to win. I also love Jamie Raskin. This is going to sound odd, but a Raskin/Liz Cheney ticket would excite me.
Not the best candidate by any means. I rate him no better than Bill Clinton. We have better prospects: Jamie Raskin, Elizabeth Warren, Jeff Merkley, Sheldon Whitehouse, Cory Booker, Pete Buttigieg...
lol a monkey has more intelligence than your list. You may not have liked Clinton but the rest of your party idolized him until the messiah came along and won in 08’
He will absolutely kill the down ballot. They must do something now, but unfortunately, there's little time and Biden's family, including Jill will cling to the notion he can still win in this state and not convince him to do the right thing. If anything, the convention will be chaos now.
Liz, We can be heard if we organize. As a start, I would suggest we read NYTIMES Editorialist Thomas L. Friedman’s heartfelt piece “President Biden Is My Friend. He Must Bow Out of the Race” posted June 28th, 2024 1:57 a.m. ET.
I also would note, as I scrolled through this thread and observed several replacements under discussion, my mind kept circling back to two governors whom I believe would make the strongest ticket our Party could deliver: Wes Moore of Maryland and Gretchen Whitmer of Michigan. Still, I believe we would best be served were a roster of highly qualified candidates afforded the opportunity (there’s still time) to battle for the nomination.
Danny While your concerns regarding Moore’s short tenure to date as Governor are legitimate, a quick look at his Wikipedia page referencing his work as Governor might allay some of your apprehension. Moreover, I would note that Republican former Governor of Maryland Larry Hogan’s bid for a Senate seat very much makes the race for this open seat a swing election.
Are you against RFK because you would have to admit that you are a bit of a moron? I get it. Maybe just stfu for a couple days and galvanize a thought. Currently you look silly.
Gretchen Whitmer would probably be the most viable candidate right now. There are other options I would heartily support - Booker and Buttigieg come first to mind - but with her record governing Michigan, Whitmer could step in and immediately take charge.
Terry , we get it . You’re a stupid finger pointing little bitch. You can stop talking circles now. We are deep enough in to the comments that no one is reading.
This answer should be viewed as the thinking in a spiritual lens framework: our country is on the verge of internal consummation because of universal, narrow selfishness enhanced by a raging materialism and disregard for those who have less. I believe in a God who loves us beyond description, but who is beyond distressed at our total ignorance of the messages sent by those who have moved on to an eternal life: Our Lady at Lourdes and Fatima warned the world what would happen if we did not change our priorities. I am afraid that the time has come to pay the piper. The Biden-Trump debacle is Exhibit "A" of a choice's consequences we all made decades ago.
It has come to this: we must reconcile with Our Lord and eternity - - or Armageddon awaits.
Sad night indeed. Biden could and should have said he is happy to debate Trump as soon as he finally concedes the election. Instead they normalized him again tonight. CNN appears to not have learned a thing in those trump years. And why Biden apparently would want to compete with trump playing golf will for ever stay a riddle to me. Sad night.
So right. I found the moderation extremely poor, whether deliberately so or not. Trump was given far too much leeway to talk gutter tripe, avoid answering direct questions and pontificate on what *he* had achieved when in office, which waslargely, if not all, lies.
Is there a point to your comment? Who claimed that it was an article rather than a debate? It certainly wasn't me. CNN's moderators did an extremely poor job. Others have suggested implicit bias in that moderation, I didn't but wouldn't rule it out.
My point is pretty clear and until you lay the blame where it is... with biden, we have no hope because you are enabling someone who will lose and we all saw it a year ago.
"It was a debate, not an article." - I did not say it was an article and, to the best of my knowledge, neither did anyone else.
"CNN not to blame." I did not 'blame' CNN, though there are many who consider it to be a biased company, as indeed are most mainstream media organisations. What I wrote was that "I found the moderation extremely poor, whether deliberately so or not." That is true. I did not even 'blame' the moderators, giving them the benefit of the doubt in the last 5 words of the sentence I've just quoted.
"Step down biden" - is an opinion and offers nothing at all, being without explanation, context or justification.
As for your latest post - I don't consider it useful to "blame" for it achieves nothing. Even where I to be judgmental and all-knowing enough to lay blame, in this case I can see nothing for which to castigate Biden.
I am unable to predict the future and doubt that you are, either. However, I will not abandon a cause simply because it falters for I will not give encouragement to those who oppose that cause.
I know of no evidence to support your generalist assertion that "we have no hope" - who is "we?" ... "because *you* [i.e. me] are enabling someone who will lose" - Am I? I wasn't aware that I had such power and certainly can't imagine that, being a relatively poor, non-voting, observer, I have the ability to "enable" anyone in this election. "someone who will lose" - there we have yet another indication of your false assumption that you can predict the future. "...we all saw it a year ago." - Yet again the undefined but this time absolutist "we" which is neither accurate or even sensible.
So, at best, your "point", if it could be seen to deserve such a title, is nothing more than a personal bias, without substance, that makes false claims, assumes facts that are demonstrably untrue and offers nothing of use or relevance to the main topic of this thread.
I have read other comments of yours and it is clear that this is your bent, i.e. to write uniformed, unsupported, false assumptions which, at best, serve only to promote a personal view that is simplistic and offers litte to nothing of value to the issue at hand.
I respect your right to free speech but suggest that you use it when you have something useful to contribute rather than simply to air your foolishness in public.
I timed every response and Trump finished on time except for one instance. They let him keep responding, though. As well, they permitted Trump to NOT answer the question and instead pontificate with lies. Very bad for CNN.
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
Trump is from Seinfeld's "bizzaro world." Trump claimed the economy is good because he "cut regulation." Trump really believes that jobs are created by cutting regulation. In fact, Biden created jobs by investing in infrastructure. Despite cutting regulation to create jobs, Trump said Biden would make America a 3rd World country. Welcome to Trump's Bizzaro World that CNN normalized by not following up on Trump's repeated lies.
Had CNN weighed in to bail Joe out it would have been an even bigger disaster. I thought they did a reasonable job of trying to stay out of it. The sad truth is that Biden is well into dimentia. That should have been apparent before the ossified Democratic Establishment backed him. They pulled the same shit in bulldozing Sanders in favor of Hillary with all of her baggage. Now it's far too late, and God help us.
LeMoine, I do not agree that Biden is well into dementia. He has never been a good communicator, has always stuttered (which can be misinterpreted as dementia), and he was ill last night. I am 78 and last month had a terrible cold for over 10 days. During that time, there is no way I could have debated anyone! Give the man a break. He is human after all. There are plenty of speeches he has given this past year that are perfectly cogent.
So sick of the over 70 crowd claiming... he was just this or that, show him empathy. He had one job last night failed miserably and empathy is going to lose us the election. Step down biden.
I think you allow your own biases to prejudice your opinion, at least as far as your comment is concerned. Incidentally, there is no chance that 'God' will help "us" or should I say, it is the most improbable notion I've heard today, even after listening to Trump's tirade of lies and abuse, because there is not one example in history of 'God' ever having helped anyone. On the contrary, when it comes to either human made or natural disaster or suffering, 'God' is inevitably absent.
I used the phrase loosely. OK? Please, don't allow pedantry to overrun your otherwise reasonable commentary here. You know absolutely nothing of my "biases". If my use of the word "god" lit your fuse, I'm sorry.
I didn't claim to know your biases. I wrote that I of what I thought must be operative based on the content of your post.
It wasn't so much your reference to 'God' that caused my response to you but rather your personal opinions, bereft of evidence, regarding Biden's "dimentia" (sic) and other allegations about Democratic Party actions.
Any new Demo candidate would need to be an experienced debater, who can bulldoze through a blizzard of lies with a command of the interaction. Who is capable of that? Few people. A bright thinker who handles himself with aplomb. Who is not stigmatized with mindless support of genocide? Who also has a progressive history of support for poor and middle class needs? I wish I knew the name of such a person, but you smart people should be able to come up with one. Many people have one or two of these properties, but all of them?
If Biden does have Parkinson's, then I hope he steps down for his own health. Several people seem opposed to Gavin Newsom, but with name recognition being important, superior debate skills necessary and a limited amount of time for the other side to undermine him, makes him the best choice. Plus, he has the looks that literally attract people. Whitmer is great, but she needs a year or two on the national stange for people to get to know her.
I have a modicum of respect for Newsom and the things he's been able to accomplish, but you've obviously never been anywhere in the Midwest. "Don't California my <state>" is a major slogan in the Midwest and South. Newsom would be an even bigger liability than Biden on the national stage, simply because of the extremely poor view of California and "those left-coast LIBZZZZZ!!!!" in states that actually matter. He's a non-starter nationally, and thankfully he seems to realize that.
I agree. It has always puzzled me that humanity has such a preoccupation with trying to hit balls into holes, as though it were some superb achievement. No, I'm not anti-sport nor anti ball games, I admit that I much enjoy soccer but that doesn't alter my wondering about our obsession with such games, nor the glorification of many who play them. (Though, in that respect, perhaps I'm just jealous because I had to work for a living, not having any talent for game playing. - And before someone yells, yes, I do understand that many athletes in all manner of sport put in long and arduous time in training and only a very small number are actually rewarded very well. - However, that's another issue for another time.)
As a child I watched ants playing soccer on a sidewalk for hours. Still haven't puzzled out the rules of that game, Non Sibi. Now "American" football is a whole different game, as chess is to checkers. But as you say, that's a discussion for a different day. Good night. democracy. 🥱
Exactly. I’ll never understand why the hell a known liar, rapist and convicted felon was given the time of day as if he was a normal candidate. America is broken.
I find it extremely interesting that CNN’s post debate commentary has been almost entirely about teeing up the idea of replacing the Biden/Harris ticket at the convention, but the DNC and the Biden campaign are apparently still not thinking that way.
Everybody, calm down. It wasn’t great for Joe, but it wasn’t terrible. He steadied himself and hit his marks. TFG prevaricated and deflected his way through it; viewers know that. He came out strong but then showed his true colors and weakened and then flailed. The format was without fact checking and, therefore, flawed. Nothing much has changed. It’ll be okay.
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
Biden did well. His stutter slowed and muttered his speech a bit, but he was uttering a mile a minute worth of detail. Volume on CNN needed adjustments. I will take experience, wisdom, patience, and stability anyway and everyday for the rest of my life over a dictator even for one day, not one single minute. FU Donnie, America has always been great because the people are great, not because of your bloated ass.
The judgment of Biden's symptoms of ageing is nothing more than ageism. In my view, it is as bad as judging the capabilities of someone with epilepsy, an amputation or some other difference as being incapable of intelligent and reasoned thought.
So, occasionally he slips up or loses his train of thought. So do I and have done for years. I also failed virtually every subject at high school yet I now have three degrees and have taught in schools, technical education and university.
I also found it extremely distasteful that Trump continually, with his usual abominable rabid style, spoke of migrants coming from "mental institutions" and being "insane". The vast majority of those who have some form of mental dysfunction, from the slight to the severe, are otherwise perfectly capable and productive members of society. If Trump was equally so, he would recognise that. That he doesn't suggests, on the basis that it 'takes one to know one', that it is more likely that Trump is the one with a real problem, not anyone who has been in a mental institution.
I have post-polio syndrome and have had to use a walking stick to get around for the last 12 years - yes, I feel feeble and may look it but my mind works as well as ever. Biden's performance over his term has been excellent and the nation is in a far better state now than when he came to office. That he has achieved as much whilst operating with a hostile and obstructionist Congress majority doing Trump's bidding, is testament to his worth.
I agree that he wasn't the youthful, dynamic and cutting figure such as was JFK in the first televised debate but that doesn't mean he's not capable.
kdsherpa, no, thank *you*, it is heartening always to find someone who can accept a criticism or contradiction or another point of view and actually consider it, let alone consider it useful or worthwhile.
"Denial is not reality" - not sure what that's supposed to mean. "Denial" is very real, as is evidenced frequently by Trump's rhetoric.
You may consider it "obvious" that Biden's mind is *not*, (no need to shout, I can read), working well but that doesn't make it so. Indeed, his performance during his term of office so far indicates quite the contrary.
Sad to disagree on Biden's handling of GAZA. He lied tonight saying Hamas has not agreed to BIDEN's Deal which Biden claimed was Israel's deal.. Israel the day following Biden's pronouncement, said it had to "finish the job" and had not agreed to what Biden represented as coming from Israel. Hamas wants a permanent ceasefire, not one of those partial ceasefires that puts civilians back in the murder zone after some hostages are released. On this alone, I cannot forgive Biden. It is genocide with American made bombs and billions in armaments. I would not have voted Biden or Trump. Jill Stein is my candidate.
I agree that it was hard to watch Biden because I have spent the past 4 years watching full clips of his speeches and interviews and he really wasn't himself tonight. But, I do want to point out that Fox and MSNBC reported that he has a cold. Being that my entire family has been suffering with nasty colds, sore throats, strep and I currently have COVID, I'm inclined to believe this might be true. Please mask up if you're sick and in public or just stay home!
YES! The continuous slurs toward immigrants were horrendous and I wish Biden had dealt with that better, starting with the fact that we are a nation of immigrants. Trump was “dog whistling” white supremacy with those screeds against immigrants and should have been shut down.
This thread has become so convoluted I'm not sure whether your comment is really aimed at me or not. However, whether it is or not, it is a superficial and pointless opinion.
I agree, but tonight a more urgent issue is before us. Biden lost tonight, and I fear he lost the election tonight. I think Biden must step down and let another candidate be selected at the convention. He has been a wonderful public servant, and I am grateful to him for everything he has done for us (except limit Anita Hill's corroborating testimony) which probably gave us Justice Thomas). But, now, for the good of the country, he must step down.
Biden is not senile. He has a lifeling severe stuttering problem he has had his entire life and has therapy for. My 32 yr old daughter talks exactly like this
Phoebe and Suzanne, I agree. My comments about Biden below do not include his stuttering. This, by itself, is not a game changer. For me, it was the general energy level and the slow response to challenge. I could tell that when he was answering policy questions, his mind tried to remember details that he had rehearsed with his debate prep team. This is understandable with all the details of new policies that Biden has put in place. But the slow responses were also compared with the rapid-fire response of Trump who, of course, when addressing policy, outright lied. Biden just was not up to all this. Confronting Trump is a difficult roe to hoe. But this is why Prof. Reich's quotes at the beginning of his post are so important. It takes someone very experienced in debate performance to counter this.
Have you ever seen someone with severe stuttering? This is classic stuttering. Not mild. Stuttering is a neurological disease that affects the part of the brain that manages oral speech. They know what they want to say. The words dont come out. They thought my daughter was mentally deficient & insisted on her being in special ed. In her senior yr a therapist worked with her and dhe graduated in regular school with honors. Have u ever lived with someone with severe stuttering???
Do you know who arranged the debate? The time, place & format of the debate? Biden brought this on himself. And 1 of the main things people were looking for in this debate was verifying which, if either, of the candidates fit the description of cognitive decline that both sides were claiming about the other side. Unfortunately, it was Trump that was more articulate & in charge. The only salvation for Biden is that any knowledgeable person paying any attention to what Trump was saying could see he was lying throughout the debate & saying some horrifying things.
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
I find it incomprehensible that Biden's handlers thought it would be a good idea to put him into a televised debate. Biden has been the 'safe pair of hands' for decades, even before VP to Obama, but he was never considered any good in public, despite the occasional well-written speech.
It can be no surprise that an 80-year-old Biden was never going to be any better, but it was a sad spectacle last night and it is now so obvious to everyone - Biden MUST stand down.
Jacquelyn - agree with your trying to remember what he had rehearsed analysis. All those prep days left no room for spontaneous response. But then his "handlers" were totally afraid of spontaneous response. It is what it is. Now what?
His whole approach was imbecilic, where Trump roared and Biden pecked back with stammering statistics. No fire to emphatically say Trump was full of shit. Someone called it the evil and the feeble.
Both Fox and MSNBC said Biden has a cold right now. Being that my family has spent the past 2 weeks sick with a nasty cold, strep throat and I have COVID, I'm inclined to think that is true. It's rough out there right now. Mask up if you are sick in public please or just stay home!
Phoebe. He looks feeble and incompetent and that is how he is seen fair or not. We need to win, and biden lost the election last night if he continues.
Human beings will always solve the pragmatic threat before the existential one. The pragmatic threat is that our current president looks like he had a stoke. That is more pragmatically important than an existential crisis. I hate democrats today. This was avoidable.
Actually, Biden was also pro-Vietnam War ( an anomaly among Dems even then), pro-Iraq War, pro-policies that led to mass incarceration of Blacks, etc. He does love power and the adoration that comes with it, but that has its dark side, which we are seeing play out.
He was not pro Vietnam. Stop spreading that malinformation. He stated in his book that he thought the protestors were being aholes at the time for breaking into the college offices, but his record in Congress was against the war.
So, we have it confirmed for us (as if we did not already know): Joe is old, Trump is a louse. Speaking just for me, I'll take the honest mumbler over the snappy liar. Tough to sell to other folks, though.
No disagreement here…..just fearful cause I live in north Atlanta suburbs where Biden won GA I. 2020 cause 30,000 Republicans opted NOT to vote for Trump allowing Biden to Win GA with less than 12,000 votes!! 7 states, and a universe of 500,000 voters will decide who are next president is going to be…..and Joe was trailing in each of those states before tonight’s disastrous performance……we need to get real NOW or we will all be crying in our soup come Election Day when the pyscho is announced the victor!! ☹️
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
Joe Biden can debate so long as he is not concerned with providing statistical proof of his accomplishments. And he needs to begin every answer with a reminder to the audiences that “the Republican candidate is a rapist, fraud, thief and a liar.”
Agreed but the fact that he can’t figure all this out and do it is on him….look the man has accomplished more than folks like me will ever accomplish in my lifetime….so kudos to him….but we are all mortal and being President ages all —see Obama See George W. bush — and they were much younger than Biden is now!! It’s a the crushingly unfair part of being human!! Life is short and anyone living at the level of being president ages even faster!! That he his family and his close associates don’t or won’t see that is what is truly tragic….
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
I voted for Bill Clinton 2x. He may have a similar resume as Trump to an extent but he was accountable and owned up to it. Trump hasn’t owned up to anything. And the GOP-Trump policies of no tax, no regulation is exactly what we don’t need. Democratic policies made this country great…..not GOP non government policies.
Oh, ye of little faith. Biden did not have to sing a Puccini aria tonight, but he did miss a few opportunities to refute Trump’s lies.
Still, being president does not mean he must give answers that take two minutes to formulate on every issue. Being president takes far more than what one narrow and mostly insignificant measure like a sterile presidential “debate” with a cold and a stutter against a lying felon requires.
I’m not hedging his abilities on such a measure. I’m betting on his experience, integrity, affinity for the truth, his sense of respect and decency, and his ability to surround himself with the best people for the jobs that governance requires. Only the short-sided judge him on tonight.
We don’t assess success on one criterion. As president, Biden is thoughtful and considers all the details and evidence. Debates require ultrafast thinking and sometimes reckless pivoting. That’s not something I want in a president anyway. Obama was a great speaker, but Biden has been a far better president even in just his first term than his former boss was in two. And as I recall, Obama tanked on his first debate.
I am appalled at how many are so quick to throw this man under a bus just because of one stupid debate that wasn’t even a debate: Trump lied and bloviated without producing a shred of evidence to back up his claims. Biden never was a strong speaker, so why would we be surprised that he did not exude over-confidence? This debate isn’t a requirement to run the country—sound and solid knowledge and experience are definitely required. Biden more than fits the bill. You all should be ashamed of yourselves.
Here, Here!!! I love Joe Biden and I also love Kamala Harris. Biden has been mentoring her well and putting her to work all over the world and US. I would be very happy to see her as President, should the good Lord call Biden home! So we have an FDR-Truman situation. We can live with that! What we can't live with is a white Christian Nationalist theocracy ruled by an antichrist! I'm a Christian and I'm already planning my exodus from this country if Trump takes over. I don't want to be forced to worship this brand of Christianity.
You are wrong. He lost the election right now for young and undecided. This is over. Step down biden. Most of the electorate is short cited. Get out of your tower and into the streets
I almost can't wait for him to lose so you can hear me say... I told you so. Young people won't be reached by grass roots and moved to vote. They will just pass. There, I told you so. People like you are enabling an adict, which is the democratic party believing it's own crap and ignoring what is in front of them.
Lisa, we all need to be realistic! What you have written here is very profound and effective, but IF Biden truly has Parkinson's and everyone surrounding him is keeping it under wraps, then that is another story. Do YOU have the inside story??
Parkinson’s isn’t even on the radar, but maybe you have an inside story? The bottom line is he was able to speak lucidly and with intent a good portion of the evening. It was said he had a cold. I can tell you that when I’m sick, I do not always perform my best.
Unfortunately, I feel that the far-right fascists have been working to dismantle our democracy for years. How can we stop this evil plot? I feel discouraged.
Mary, you are correct -- the far-right have indeed been working to dismantle our democracy. But to counter this, we need a person who projects the strength to turn this situation around, convince the American electorate that THEY CAN DO IT, and then get elected. I'm sorry to say that I don't think Biden is up to the task.
Bernie Sanders could've given everybody hell and had things running smoothly. Throw Elizabeth Warren into the mix . . . Oh how the "Dems in charge" botched everything!
Unfortunately, the far-left fascists have been working to dismantle our democracy for years here in California with a single party rule by the DNC. Our state has become the Peoples Republic of California.
I lived in California for 15 years. (SF Bay Area) Best protections for the consumer, first to put laws in place protecting environment on and on. I miss CA when I visit…brings back good memories.
Yep. Porter Cologne—California’s Clean Water Act, which the Feds borrowed heavily from when the nationwide Clean Water Act was drafted and put into effect in the late 1960s/early 1970s. I’m a California native and very proud to live here.
I am in Alabama and wish so much I could move. Financially prohibited now . ..and I am hmm.. elderly. There are all kinds of people in every state. But in the Southern states there are so many Trumpsters.Ive spent some time in Africa and believe me that does NOT necessarily make me a popular white female. It’s daunting here..
Wow most people don’t like to live in filth. But you must have lived in it so long that you like it. But I don’t live in California and have intently made sure that whatever decisions I made never had me end up there
Fascist normally includes words Far-RIght added to single person, party or group government rule.
I simple make the point that a "single party or group controlling government" can be defined as either Far Left or Right. Either moving toward Communism or moving toward Dictatorship. Fascist does not have to be one person but rather a single party/group seeking control.
Fascism is defined as a “single person, party or group government rule” and yes, normally as of Far-right Nationalist believe. After further thinking, You’re correct, Fascist party central government rule is the Far-RIght, to what the Communist party central government rule is the Far-Left.
Using only those terms, I was searching for a label to our single person, single party government rule that California has experienced for most of these past 35 years.
Example; California’s top two candidate voting rule. Halving single party rule the choice in most, if not all elections is between two democrat's!
Why would ANYONE support a party that caters to supporters of Sedition that we watched live on TV and a 34 count FELON? A rapist?
Republicans never help working people or the environment because they cater to corporations. They gave now become full on Fascist supporters. The republican party is supporting a Fascist candidate.!
I’m afraid too. And I returned to the states and at the airport, I felt the fear and sadness.If been gone for 2 years. The people of this nation are in no way prepared for the chaos and loss that could be coming here. It’s way beyond stocking up on toilet paper snd bottled water… I hate fear.I hate what’s happening…
A-a-amen! The DNC has let us down this time more than ever before!!
They should quickly recruit Gretchen Whitmer and Elizabeth Warren!!! Or there are other great combinations of people as well to pull together for the convention!
So glad someone else is saying this! It wouldn't matter how qualified she was either. She could be the most perfect candidate of all. But this country accepting a woman as our president is just not happening anytime soon! Even if Hillarys 'email situation' would not have came about, she wasn't going to win the electoral vote in '16 either. I well remember conversations with my dad during the '16 campaign. He could be abit of a misogynist so I was surprised he backed Hillary. I guess he did because he was well familiar with trumps true character as he was a long distance trucker and delivered many loads into NYC. in the 80s. I told him dad our country will not allow a female president. He turned to me on election night and said well you were right after all.
Exactly. The Dems need to pick a replacement STAT! If Biden had chosen and coached his successor during this term we wouldn’t have this problem. But, “better late than never.” Reviewing the debate is a waste of our time, we need to decide on a candidate and move on. Trump is not a permanent condition - life can change in a MOMENT!
Outstanding in the face of the MAGAmussolini's assault on the truth. I was especially disappointed in the lack of push-back by the so-called "moderators" for moderation is not something they did at all. Not allowing fact-checking was a huge blunder. Another thing about the "moderators" is their timing of the MAGAmussolini. He got five minutes more speaking time than Biden.
Major Garrett later did an abbreviated version of fact checking.
But it seems journalists in general, prefer controversy over dull as sawdust facts. I think it would have helped, had the President been dismissive, of the lying multiple felon, twice impeached, doc snatching sore LOSER.
Tonight Rachel Maddow capped her reporting on Biden’s poor performance with a review of the first debates of incumbent Presidents going back to the beginning. Every single one bombed his first debate. Most went on to win reelection. Yes, Biden’s performance was heartbreaking, but let’s not overreact!! The man who presided over the incredible list of legislative accomplishments Biden has delivered in his first term should not be counted out b/c of a bad night. Probably he had a fever in addition to the obvious cold. But in any case, this election is far from lost. There are steps the campaign should take to move forward in a positive way—and quickly. All of us who support the President can help. Don’t doom and gloom. Work harder!! Btw, despite the MAGA gloating, Trump absolutely lost on substance, despite his TV actor confidence. He lied repeatedly, and he failed to answer many questions. Supporters need to parse the former guy’s performance and get that info out there. Biden needs to own his flop and deliver a string of vigorous performances featuring himself as a man of honor and integrity with a viable and specific vision for the future. This night is more than salvageable; let’s do it!!
All this is true but, in my opinion, beside the point. That point is that Joe Biden needed to save his campaign by giving the lie to all the statements and perceptions that he is an old man who can no longer do the job. Instead, he basically showed how true that is. It was a disaster. And here for me a mea culpa. To an earlier piece in this newsletter stressing fear that Joe Biden might come on in this debate as weak, I had thought that "no, Biden knows what is at stake, and will come out swinging as he has in his last two State of the Union speeches." How wrong I was. The debate was a catastrophe for him and the election will be for one for the Democratic party and more importantly, for the country if Joe Biden is the Democratic Party nominee for President, as looks certain to be the case at this point.
Dunno what universe everybody is in but it ain't mine. Biden focused on the questions and did refute #DonTheCon many times over. #Don could not even string two coherent sentences together. He rambled aimlessly and was clearly senile. #Don displayed a complete lack of focus and inability to control himself. Biden looked sick as a ghost but still focused and answered the questions intelligently.
Unfortunately body language and tone of voice affect listeners much more than content. This has been shown by psychological testing. 45 dominated the debate.
So we folks with speech problems are doomed. Maybe the next debate should not have any sound on--just closed captioning. That would get people right down to the content. I watched with captioning because of a hearing defect and I was very tuned in to policy and relevance. Biden did well in both of these areas, whereas Trump just rambled on nonsensically.
Ms. Billie, Can't refute you. Except to say that Biden's attempts to answer policy questions is what most of the electorate are NOT looking for. Most are looking for superhuman strength and that one person who can say 'I am the only one who can solve this.' Whether this statement is true or not is besides the point.
You are correct is your assessment. As a person with a speech problem (not the same one as Biden has), I know just how difficult it is to make an intelligent point and keep the listener engaged. I love Biden's policies and I loved his answers to the questions.
The answer for us is clear, we have to go out and vote a straight Blue ticket. We can’t let these criminals back in power. They are ruining our country.
My concern now, which was always in the back of my mind, is what we can expect from Biden 4 years from now...or even one, should he somehow win?? I'm not optimistic anymore, and it kills me to say so.
Why? Because he was battling a cold and looked like a ghost? While I think the makeup department could have done a better job, IMHO, the ghost is more alert and aware and relevet any day rather than the orange senile #DonTheCon.
Seems like tfg simply was gloating about his supporters backing him up, even had he failed miserably. Even though the media did catch him lying. INMO, the current President should have acted dismissive, rather than sincere. Sincerity and honesty are viewed by those of poor character, as weakness. And unfortunately, those of poor character, are the ones given all the hype.
Biden is going to lose and 100% self imposed as hubris and lack of succession planning (like Hilary against trump and obama) for Biden and the DNC. He should have never run again.
Calling him senile perpetuates the myth people who stutter are mentally defective. Its a language disorder. Its like making fun of someone with tourettes syndrome or on the autisn spectrum. Ive met joe biden and he is not senile. How is ge not different than king george? https://youtu.be/qvWRf4_ydCw?si=2mbKnAFfwWL1w536
Oh phoebe, i love the speach for the downtrodden, but we have an election we need to win. Take the lefty... be nice to people who stutter.... i get it, but we need to win an election. And I can't convince everyone to be nice as a strategy.
I guess that was tough to watch, but there were no surprises here. We all know who these guys are and what’s at stake. I don’t care if our candidate was deaf and blind, and couldn’t remember his own name. Here’s my take and I’m sticking with it…
We have a choice between…
Lies and Truth
Filth and Honor
War and Peace
Chaos or Commitment
Division or Unity
Neo Nazis or American Heroes
Hatred or Hope
Racism or Equality
Rape or Respect
Servitude or Liberty
Fascism or Freedom
The Past or the Future
Wrong or Right
Nato or Putin
Corruption or Construction
Dictatorship or Democracy
It is not the party - it is the country
It is not a man - its an idea
It is not a Corporation
It is “We, the People”
Its not a Demagogue
Its the UNITED STATES of America
That’s who I’m voting for.
Bravo! Joe Biden has been the best president in my lifetime. He obviously had a bad cold tonight. He’s been working nonstop on domestic and international issues. He was subjected to a malignant narcissist and pathological liar who was allowed to spew incessant falsehoods without fact-checking and without being directed to answer the questions asked. This disaster is solely the responsibility of CNN.
The moderators were/are cowards
and did not do their job. CNN is a disaster.
I agree. It wasn't until the second half of the debate that they allowed Biden to finish his time, telling him he had some more minutes left. In the first half of the debate, as soon as Biden finished a thought, they went to Trump! Thus, I'm sure Trump got way more time than Biden. And he used his time to be bully. It simply wasn't fair. And why did they not stop Trump when he was spewing obvious lies! Ask for evidence of some of his outrageous claims! That's what good moderators do.
How is it the moderators fault that Biden did not use his time? You said he finished his thought? So if he was finished why did the moderators have to do his thinking for him? Oh, right because he is senile, got it
Not everyone who is of a certain age is senile and Joe Biden has certainly been very capable of running this country and has done so extremely well with help of course from his advisors like the vast majority of our presidents.
You mean his handlers. He does not even know where he is most of the time. Extremely well? Like record high inflation and record amount of illegals coming across. If that is extremely well, I hope we have less of what you say is well
Bc - when presented the question. Trump didn’t answer - he blathered on about Biden’s previous response -
Ie; Trump was asked if he will round up all immigrants that haven’t had their court case heard or are here illegally and deport them and how will he do that ?
So let me ask one question then I will answer yours.
Do you support 100% of Biden’s policies?
Sir you are mistaking senility with a man who had a problem speaking because of an apparent cold virus.
lol then he has a cold since before he became president
Yes this was a money-making proposition for CNN and the network. I felt that they did a very poor job in not insisting that Trump stick to answering the actual question he is being asked. I believe that had a great deal to do with the disastrous results because Trump just kept telling lie after lie.
CNN not the problem. Biden is. We need to stop putting blame anywhere else than where it is. Step down Biden, please
Trump didn’t answer the questions presented 90% of the time - the moderators should have readdressed
Could be a deal: Trump in jail. That is the aim of Biden fulfilled: no more years for Trump in the white house. So then Biden could step down...
This is why the cry for “younger” falls on deaf ears. The “younger” “personalities” on media show the “younger” generation isn’t yet up to the job of handling such serious responsibilities.
CNN 100% did their job. Stop blaming them. Step down biden.
You think that maybe the man who lied incessantly, and probably believed his own lies - I.e. he is delusional - should step down?
YEP, journalists should analyse, order for the public, moderate. That is more then let your victims run a race against time...
I like Biden too but unfortunately the facts don’t care about our feelings.
It’s delusional to think that someone like a white knight on a horse is going to appear to take Biden‘s place as a candidate. It simply is not going to happen four months before the election. Republican candidates do all kinds of horrid things, and Republicans still stand behind them. Our best bet now is to stand behind Biden, the way Republicans stand behind their convicted felon.
Biden failed tonight to convince the American people that he’s up to the job. It’s heartbreaking.
He has a chance to make up for that in the second debate (if there is one) and in his public appearances.
He should make a video in which to present what he’s done for regular people and to counter Trump’s lies, and plaster it all over Tik-tok and elsewhere.
I doubt Trump will agree to a 2nd debate, Janet, at least unless his poll numbers are below Biden's. They will go up after this debate. Performance nearly always outweighs substance in debates in viewers' minds. Trump greatly outperformed Biden, looking strong, forceful & articulate with a superior presence of mind, even if everything he said was pure lies & projection. A major test of this debate was to see which candidate had a sharper mind, & unfortunately Trump won on that account tonight. Very disappointing!
Biden needs new handlers. People don't want facts. They want strength, power and fearlessness on display. Facts are meaningless to the masses.
I would say based on the first debate Biden should stay away from further debates. He's just not up to it. Did you see how he could barely walk out on stage? Did you notice how nervous he was and how you could barely hear or understand his words? Did you notice his seeming unability to put Trump in his place on most issues that Trump lied about? It was a bloody massacre. I love Joe, but his physical decline is hard to watch. How can he possibly withstand 4 more years? Did you see the pitiful way Jill Biden tried to be the enthisiasm leader after the debate? How she ledJoe into the waffle house and Joe looked like he could bsrely move/talk, that he was in a daze? I don't wish this for him or the country, but it's true.
… If there is a second debate.
What second debate? Trump won this one he's going to take his money and run. There is not going to be another one. I've voted for Democratic presidents ever since George HW Bush but I'm sitting this one out if the Democrats don't do something during the convention because its a lost cause. Lets face it the MAGA's out smarted them.
That's just not true. He called for the debates. He boasted about how it would go. And then he did THAT.
There is no way to make up for THAT.
The debates, themselves, were supposed to make up for ground he lost by demonstrating how deep his racism goes (all the way down to genocide).
Instead of making up some of the support he drove away, he drove away even more support.
Claiming he can "make up for" THAT — at THIS point — is the desperate self-delusion of a gambling addict.
Gambling with American democracy.
Just to preserve one narcissistic geriatric racist, who surrounds himself with yes-men, and ignores the will of the people when it suits him. As if "he alone" can defeat the other narcissistic geriatric racist, who surrounds himself with yes-men, ignores the will of the people, and has been handed a very effective plan to rid himself — and America — of democracy's last scraps.
Not only is Joe Biden not the best man for the job, but I think it's ludicrous, at this point, to presume he's on America's side.
Trump will take last night as a win and refuse another show!
He has a chance, but he is likely to do worse, not better. I predict that if Biden is the nominee, Trump will win. It's not too late to change horses here.
Why is no criticism directed at the convicted felon, who lied for 90 minutes and said that overturning Roe was his "gift" to America? He called America the worst country in the world - Why is there no call for him to step down and for the GOP to find a suitable candidate??
Yesterday, SCOTUS punted the EMTALA case and 2 men argued that women DO NOT HAVE A RIGHT TO LIFESAVING CARE - why are you not making that point and defending us?
To support trump the GOP printed "proud to be a felon" t-shirts and wore diapers for christ's sake!
People need to get a grip and stop wishing for unicorns.
There is no magic white male candidate coming to save the day.
Volunteer every day to turn out the vote and punch back against a lawless authoritarian and his democracy ending Project 2025.
Thanks Marilee. You have nailed it. All these people seeing Biden as a total loss completely have forgotten everything he’s done for this country over the past three years and how he literally brought us back from the brink. It’s rather sad.
Biden is up to the job because he is DOING THE JOB!
His is one of the most successful administrations in modern history.
Every successful, smart, well prepared woman who has ever been talked over by a bro in a meeting or a board room sees right through this.
This is bro culture in a nutshell....
(And no one would be looking for a white knight if our VP was a white man)
Again, you nailed it and I could not agree more. This is apparently a country where superficiality, appearances, and bravado are more important than substance and soul. And that’s a very sad statement about America.
No, this is reality. He does not LOOK like he's up for the job - and that's what's going to matter to swing voters - who will be deciding the election.
People need to realize that the president is NOT running America by himself. Trump may believe that, but the truth is the administration and all of the people appointed there are the runs running America! I will vote for Biden regardless of what happened in the debate. I will NEVER support an outright liar like trump is!
We are also talking about an amazing administration. We have a president who has put together a fantastic team, with very few staff changes, gaining experience that can only benefit the nation even more with another term. We have a president who wants a team, respects his team, and makes decisions with his team. We know the felonious rapist liar is a one-man show. His goals are to keep himself out of prison and grab the rest of America by the p*s*y. That's it. Anybody who doesn't support the blue ticket as it stands now or whatever it becomes is choosing that. No good will come to them or the rest of us. It'll be a new Dark Age.
You can't tell the people what they need to believe Jan, Just like the Democratic Party can't tell the people they should feel good because of Biden's accomplishments.
You make a good point, Jan. A presidency is the sum of the people a president surrounds himself with and the causes and policies they are committed to pormoting and, hopefully, enacting. I would much rather have a Biden White House than a Trump Hell Holel.
Thanks for a dose of reality! It was more than painful!
Not just America Mike! I'm currently in the UK & while not super surprising, his performance is reverberating here. His recent European trip, i'm afraid, set a tone.....A good man, for sure, but too old, & not up to the rigors & enormity of the job.
Compared to a convicted felon
He’s as much up
To the job as thst idiot liar narcissist ahole on the other side that didn’t answer even one question presented
Biden's fault for not calling him out, but Trump kept Biden against the ropes with lie after lie, pummeled him, and the moderators let Trump lie, that is the way the "debate" was set up. Trump came on stage belligerent ready for a WWI match, because he was primed to attack, over and over with lies, knowing that he could get away with the act.
Some weeks ago, I was down for the count a few days. My husband didn't abandon me.
from JEFF TIEDRICH>>
Ever hear of the Gish Gallop?
The Gish gallop is a rhetorical technique in which a person in a debate attempts to overwhelm their opponent by providing an excessive number of arguments with no regard for the accuracy or strength of those arguments. He lied, and then poured another lie on top of the lie, and then poured half-dozen half-truths and straw-men arguments on top of those lies. It was overwhelming.
Inflation, covid, jobs, foreign policy, January 6th, climate change — every one of Donny’s “answers” followed the same format:
Mine was the greatest. It was the greatest ever. It was great. Everyone said how great it was. the greatest. then he came in and now it’s a disaster. Everyone says it’s a disaster. When I get back in it’s gonna be great again.
REAL TIME moderation was ESSENTIAL!!!
CNN, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash should all dig a hole, jump into it and pull it closed over themselves. What they perpetrated last night was journalistic infamy.
The problem is TRUMP!!!
I think if Gary Newsome came forward now, or Jamie RASKIN, the Dems would have a landslide victory. It isn’t too late. Let’s do the practical thing. Joe is not going to make it through four more years, and Kamala hasn’t made enough of a good impression on people to be a popular choice.
The Republicans have changed the game while we Dems live by the old, plodding rules of decency. It is time to shake the box. I refuse to live under a fascist Trump regime. Let's go ballistic and switch to a new candidate. Who? I would support Jamie Raskin (not Newsome) because he is a constitutional scholar, super smart and can be aggressive as hell....
Beshear just got reelected governor over McConnells hand picked candidate
Raskin is recovering from cancer
As if “we” can switch to a new candidate. 🫠
Why? Because she's the wrong colour or the wrong gender? Frankly, from over here in europe, its dazzlingly obvious that the Reps are arseh*les, and choosing that bloated pig as their leader is INSANE!!
That's America for you, racist and sexist to the core. And it starts at the highest levels, the donor class.
Mexico just elected a Jewish female of all things, and Hispania is the epitome of Catholic patriarchal misogyny.
Pakistan, had a female president, and there is nothing more anti female than Islam, except evangelical and fundamentalist Christianity.
America shit a brick because a black happened to get elected and re elected, and retaliated by electing Trump.
Macht Nichts
I would vote for Raskin in a heartbeat. Make him the VP candidate and shift Harris to AG to replace the weak and ineffectual Garland. But given the corruption and suicidal tendencies of the DNC gang, this is not likely to happen.
I am totally with you. I would also vote for Raskin in a minute.
Gavin
As a strident conservative, I agree. Run more to the Left. Lol!
Yes. I'd choose him too.
I totally agree with you, Jude. Those are the two people I also would love to see put up by the Dems against Trump. They would slaughter him!
If Cory Booker could paint himself white he would be the obvious Dem choice.
Hell. I meant Gavin, not Gary. Gavin Newsome.
Democrats who wish for the Shiny New Penny are delusional. Joe Biden continues to be a remarkably effective president. He had a bad debate night. That's all. The other guy incessantly trash-talked our country and blatantly lied. I'm contributing money to the Biden-Harris campaign today. I don't need a shiny new penny. I like the looks of my Old Silver Dollar.
I agree. Strongly.
When in a hole, keep on digging! right?
Biden has been a great president!! If he were brain dead he would be would still be great. Unfortunately, elections are not decided based on facts, policies, or accomplishments. There is only one explanation as to why the polls are close. As the tRump's have argued it is all about strength vs weakness. If facts mattered this election would be no contest, but the perceived image is all that matters. The candidate bases are unshakable. Any voter who is undecided thinks tRump is despicable and Biden is too old. Undecided? Proof facts are irrelevant. Perceived image is all that matters and facts are irrelevant.
If that were the case, then why did Biden win by a large margin in 2020? Because people are sick of Trump, and he’s only gotten worse since then. Now suddenly all those folks are going to embrace him? I have a hard time believing that millions of people are going to flock back to Trump. That thought helps keep me sane. I hope I am right.
The Felon is a bully, a thug and a pathological liar.
I won't be bullied by his lies. After the debate, I went to the Biden-Harris campaign website and made a contribution. I hope that others will respond to the disgusting river of lies in similar fashion.
I have done the same, and I will continue to contribute.
I agree and when I hear some of these news outlets especially right after the debate saying how Joe Biden should step down but then they don't really have any idea who would take his place. They all run Kamala Harris into the ground because of their claims that she is so unpopular and that might be true for some but not all. Do I think that she would be capable of taking over should something happen to Joseph Biden? Yes I absolutely do think that she is more than capable and I am sick and tired of what is not said and that is because she is a woman and obviously a woman of color.
America deserves better.
Don't be so pessimistic, Janet. Who will have the courage to step up and run against Biden to get the Dem nomination? Biden has early dementia. Time to replace him.
I was thinking maybe Hillary Clinton. She was very popular last time she ran. I also like Gavin Newsome, but he might be too liberal. It breaks my heart to think the Dems may be hanging out to dry, with no alternate candidate who can trounce the evil-doer, Trump. There is no joy in Mudville today.
No! Everything I hear from her turns me off, and she just supported an AIPAC fave over progressive Jamaal Bowman, who wasn't the sharpest operative but who is a decent guy, from all I can see.
Hillary will get slaughtered. She couldn't stand up to Trump, an aggressive male, last time, and she has too much baggage and skeletons.
If I remember correctly, even President Obama had a terrible first debate against Mitt Romney. He made up for it in the second debate and he won. We can come back from this. We have no choice but to try. There needs to be some shake-up in the Biden communications team, and I hope Jill Biden has a role in bringing that about.
Obama did. He learned from it, & he has great oratory skills that can be useful in a debate. Biden is hampered by his stuttering, his tendency to get flustered & difficulty in completing a thought.
I don’t think he has difficulty in completing a thought; I think he had a really bad cold, and they were unable to postpone the debate because it would not look good if he had done that. We are in an unfortunate situation where millions of Americans are superficial assholes. I can’t control that these feeble-minded people will vote for a lying, narcissistic maniac because he appears forceful. I can’t predict what Biden‘s team or the DNC is going to do, but I don’t think anyone is going to step up to take Biden‘s place, so all this debating about replacing him is time wasted. His team needs to really take the gloves off and do something. I’m not a Democratic strategist, so I’m not sure what that is, but they need to get their act together.
Janet, you are correct. I just turned 72 & have a very bad cold. I've been in 4 NJ Governor's Cabinets & have been an Adjunct Professor at Columbia for 11 years now. I'm pretty sharp, but with this cold, I can barely juggle one ball right now. Unfortunately, perception is reality, and Joe Biden - who is an amazing President and public servant - looked old and feeble. That is what people now see and believe. Is that fair, no but it is reality.
Making excuses doesn't help Janet. I am thinking of parents called into the Principals office, who make excuses for the kids bad behavior, not the Joe's behavior is bad, but we have to face facts, he walks like he has arthritis, can't keep his balance, and talks unconvincingly and hesitantly. He is not animated or loquacious, and he did stumble up the steps of AF One
The problem is the public. Biden may be all substance, but Trump is all style, as obnoxious as it is, even though a convicted felon, the public goes for style over substance.
In 2020 his obnoxious behavior during the debate did him in,it was not presidential (style), in 2024 his behavior has been normalized as has his lies.
Also, Biden is an evil moron since the crime bill.
Obama is too thoughtful and polite. Doesn't work well in our present environment. Remember Reality TV, competition, conflict are the life blood of America.
You don't win in war, games or politics by playing by the rules, you don't win by being on the defense, you don't win by being polite and considerate. You don't win by being smarter than the other guy either, you win by being ruthless, in politics, business, stock market
Every play monopoly?
Joe is not Obama...
Unfortunately, the places where Biden is more solid than Obama don't seem to count. On the other hand, I just got something pushing Michelle Obama, who may have Ivy League degrees, but hasn't ever worked in politics.
Sad but true.
Obama wasn't 80 years old. Unfortunately I fear that things will only become worse and it seems sooner than later.
I love your heart and your spirit but I am afraid that the next one, if there is one, Joe will fare worse. He will watch this performance and be quite saddened by who he appeared to be. I know in his mind he sees himself as he was, I do as well but when I shave I know better. Joe needs to shave.
I hope not! Jill looked like she was "helping" Joe down the 1 or 2 steps to greet the moderators. She makes him look more frail.
He is OLD
So am I and so are a lot of Americans.
But he does treat his wife a lot better than the other guy treated any of his.
Obama wasn't 81
There were no facts, not even a chiron noting the truth.
At the outset the visuals were wrong. Biden walks on stage stiff legged. Then Trump charges on exhibiting angry and hyper aggression.
Trump dominated, he lied,lied, lied and there was no fact checking by the moderator, he manages to spew 20 lies within the time allotted, and put Biden on the defense. You aren't going to win anything on the defense.
In the first 20 or 30 minutes, Joe tries to defend himself and loses his train of thought, stumbles, and at that point the pain was so much that I turned off the TV.
Yes Trump lied and lied and lied, he was his usual hyper aggressive self and all Biden could do was say "that's a lie".
For the good of democracy, for the good of the Republic, Joe should step aside, but if he does the way the Democratic party is organized that will mean Kamala will be the nominee, and she is just as weak in confrontation and debate as Biden.
It is not a matter of loyalty, of honesty,of goodness, of empathy, or gender it is a matter of saving Democracy. And Saturday nights Biden won't do.
The committed won't change their minds because of the debate. I certainly won't. I'd vote Biden if he crawled on stage and mumbled, anything but Trump. But not so for the millions of fence sitters., and those that don't pay attention to what is going on in the landscape,much less politics.
Unfortunately there is no race horse in the Democratic stable, that has been groomed, and that is why we got Biden in 2020, not to mention 2024.
I've said it before, I'll say it again Biden did not win the election, Trump lost. 81 million people showed up to clean out the 'Aegean stable and return an Offal Office to an Oval Office
It is not the candidate that is the problem it is the party. They had their chance in 2016, when they redid the Democratic party, instead of new leadership, they put Tom Perez, and establishment hack in charge.
The Republican party favors demagogic right wing populists that appeal to baser instincts, the Democratic party favors bland, non threatening milquetoasts, who don't threaten the donor class.. What we need are fired up, energetic left wing populists of the the Bernie Sanders class. Not Bernie he is too old, among other problems.
Fight fire with fire.
I agree with Janet below. It's too late to change horses, but worse there are no horses to replace the horse they are riding.
The DNC should have been grooming Gretchen Whitmer or Gavin Newsom, but in 2020 they pulled a tired old race horse from the paddock and put him in the starting gate, and he only one because the other horse hobbled himself
Kamala Harris did quite well in her debate with Mike Pence in 2020, and she has a solid track record as AG and senator of California. Were she white.....
I agree, as I said in a subsequent post, If Kamala were to head the ticket after the Democratic National convention in Aug, she would start with 226 electoral votes from Democrat and Democrat leaning states.
Mi, PA and WI have 45 electoral votes, and Kamala is not hindered by the anti Biden Muslim and black sentiment that Biden has in those states. that give her 271 votes, and she wins.
I was one who favored Biden stepping down before he announced he was running again. That would have been the time to do it, because he said even during his initial campaign that he was a transitional president. Then he changed his mind and decided he wanted four more years. The DNC went along with that. Now, four months before the election, I don’t know how you shove a new candidate in front of the public. I think that will make the Democratic Party seem even weaker. Just like the Republicans stand up for their malignant narcissist of a convicted felon, I think we need to stand up for our candidate and move forward, and stop all this ruminating about what could or should have been.
Janet: I am with you, however I think it was the DNC that asked Biden to run,simply because they don't have any race horses warming up in the paddock, much less in the stable.
For a horse to be brought to the starting gate in the DNC, it must first have the approval of the "owners" (the donor class, then it must have the right credentials, and prove that it is well trained and obedient to the whip.
I kept tabs of how many times Bill Clinton sang the praises of "international financial institutions" (21 times in his speeches, there in lies a clue, that and the fact that when he left office, penniless, save for Hillary's advance on her book, he was gifted his own non profit, The Clinton Global Initiative, which provided him a nice executive salary.
The threat to the donor class, the money powers, comes from young blood, the progressives, they are change agents who appeal to the masses. The DNC's fear of change, opened the door for Trump, who promised change, even though that change was regressive.
Change from the status quo can be regressive or progressive. 40% of America or better is for regressive change..Back to the Future.
A six month in-depth investigation into what obligations both men have been committed to and have accomplished would be very enlightening to help explain their performances tonight.
Nope. That won't help. Step down Biden
Nope. The fainthearts need to step down and let the Braveheart steady on. I mean, how fickle must one be to abandon a good WORLD leader over a headcold?
Agreed. Gutless, piss-poor moderating. They should have cut off the mics (and ideally applied an electric shock) the instant one of the contestants deviated from answering the question or tried to go back and argue a previous topic.
I like your electric shock idea. :)
The moderators were terrible; it was obvious that President Biden was sick, and nothing was done to refute Trump’s lies. Future debates should be cancelled.
It's a maxim in cold contact sales that if a sale is to be made, it'll be made within the first 30 seconds contact with the prospective customer, while the debates have become glorified "infomercials." If the prospective customer is persuaded to buy your product, they'll be persuaded to buy from >you< and be interested in hearing more of what you have to say about the product. If they're not persuaded to buy from you, nothing else you can possibly say about your product will matter and will probably just annoy whoever you're trying to pitch - who may or may not listen politely to your pitch and >then< tell you to get lost.
Apply that thinking to any commercial you've ever seen or may ever see. Now, consider last night's debate as a "live commercial," sort of like there were live commercials in early TV. Now evaluate each participant based on their first 30 seconds. That is what the public saw; that's the product the public may or may not buy - particularly in any clips (commercials) drawn from the debate. That's for >you< to judge.
I switched programs after about 15 minutes because I already knew exactly what the backwash would be. Besides, I >already know< everything both participants could possibly say in the debate, and what they'll continue to say until November. It's all been in our collective faces for >months and months! < Just sayin'.
A LITTLE WHILE LATER: Biden seems to have made up for his debate showing in an NC rally: https://youtu.be/s5CVZHAjrW8?si=HVI3s5gUsje220N- (Although I could suspect he's employing lessons learned from ol' Schitzinpantz's rallies. Then again, it shows he still learns from experience.)
I just wish >that< Biden could've shown up in the debate.
It's a long way to November in a contest where a week is an infinity.
I get what you are saying, but I believe that there are enough of us who are not that superficial when it comes to the future of Democracy.
Perhaps you're right. But I remain skeptical of the US public these days. Evidence? No. Only a question: "How is it that we have come to this juncture?"
I can’t explain the main reason why we are at this perilous juncture, but there are many aggrieved people who somehow think that a bully like Trump is going to save them. All I know is that Trump was rejected soundly in 2020, and I hope those same folks, especially women, vote in huge numbers.
That's OK. The question is rhetorical, and your conclusion is yours.
I couldn’t agree more. I was appalled by their allowing T to avoid answering questions and lying about whatever he chose to address. Particularly upsetting was the claim he made about some states even “permitting “ post birth abortions, whatever that means.
He’s been shouting that idiotic lie for years now. He disgusts me to no end.
Last time I watch CNN! The moderators were a disaster and didn't even try to fact check anything that Trump said. True that Biden did not sound good 😕 but he is like the ordinary worker who does not abuse their paid time off and is reliable and trustworthy
Chris Matthews on MSNBC said it best. 2 Jobs and they are very different. BEING President requires great leadership and teamwork. Biden is outstanding. Running for President requires Great Communication skills. Bidens have surely slipped at least for last night they did.
That is right. But Biden could bring an army of communicators in the field. It is not the man, but the team that matters.
I didn't hear that, but it makes sense to me.
If he is the best you have had hard life
Yes, Biden had a bad cold, but he is in the early stage of dementia. Time for a new candidate.
This has nothing to do with CNN. You are part of the problem. Step down biden.
A bad cold? Biden liberals are delusional and just as dangerous as Trump supporters: https://barryjkaufmando.substack.com/p/there-is-no-debate-democrats-are
No, Dr. Barry, I am not interested in your Substack.
lol I wish I could have seen this post on Babylon Bee then it would not be quit so pathetic
Thank you, Bruce. I’m not giving up because we have no choice but to make the best of a bad situation.
Yes we do. Step down today, Newsom get going
I would also like to see Newsom be able to step in. I think he would trounce Trump in both a debate and in the general election.
I’m sorry if this insults you, but you are absolutely delusional. Have a nice day.
I agree, but i feel sick that this fascist is going to destroy the free world. Trump was well prepared with his lies and ad hominem attacks; Joe just looked like a quiet victim softly stating facts, which Trump simply called lies. I’m not happy with a country or a people who would elect such a simple monster. This is the result of a deficit in our educational system and propaganda courtesy of social media. I feel like I want to fight, but I don’t know who to hit.
Or even if the hits will land! I’m voting for Biden. The alternative is to horrible to even fathom.
If Biden doesn’t step down, we’re all not only going to be fathoming it but living with it. Tonight was horrifying.
Unfortunately, you are right, Cheryl. I coulnd't watch it after the first few minutes. It was so painful. Where to go now, though? I would support, Hillary, Newsom and Jamie Raskin. Who do you think might be a good alternative to Biden?
Any of those and others—Hakeem Jeffries, Gov Whitmer, etc. The Democrats have a lot of talent. I respect Biden enormously and think he has done an exceptional job the last four years, especially in the context of an assault on our democracy by a bunch of rabid, psychopathic jackals. That said, Biden’s disastrous performance last night added large crashing cymbals to the corporate media’s relentless, “he’s-too-old” drumbeat—a drumbeat that even prior to the debate had Biden trailing in the polls despite being one of the better presidents—ever. The problem is not Biden’s lack of substance; it’s his seeming struggle to communicate it—a struggle that last night morphed into a tragic inability to do so. Whether Biden’s deer-in-the-headlights performance was due to a cold, poor debate strategy, or a debate format that seemed to favor the ex-liar-in-chief doesn’t matter, because it unfortunately supported the unfortunate narrative that Joe’s too old.
Yes, Cheryl. I agree with you on those alternatives to Biden also. And you are right about everything else you say. It is so sad. Now, we have more to fear than ever that Trump may actually become president again, and that is a truly scary thought given everything we know about him already and everything he has indicated he will do if he is president again. I like to say Trump belongs in the Big House instead of the White House. If only it were so. :(
I am with you. As long as Biden is the candidate, I am voting for him. The alternative is too awful to contemplate.
Using the leftist standard you are in a cult.
You poor dolt
Yep as usual the left can’t handle it when their standards are applied to them
But the people didn't elect him. He lost the popular vote twice.
He will lose again.
He is a complete and total fraud and a loser.
It was a terrible debate for sure but we regroup and go on the attack. Relentlessly for the next 5 months.
Voter apathy is our greatest enemy.
Completely agree.
www.fieldteam6.org
The people in the system we have did elect him. Wake up.
Hey QAnon wants their talking points back. If we used popular vote then California and New York would elect all our presidents and we would be in as bad a shape as those two states. But since the process does not depend on popular vote but with the electoral college (you know the one that the left loves to defend if it goes their way) then you post is pointless.
President Biden has Parkinson's Disease. I have held my tongue for weeks now, in the hope that someone in his entourage would have him see a doctor who knows what he's doing. Parkinson's, along with its almost invevitable concomitant of REM sleep disorder, can make a patient look frail and confused during the day.
The sad thing is, for Biden and the country, that this is a highly treatable condition in its early stages, and Biden could do well for many more years.
Now it's too late.
As Sir Leopold Amery famously said to Neville Chamberlain 84 years ago, "In the name of God, go!"
Indeed. I have some personal experience with someone who suffers from Parkinson’s. She’s 82, and was diagnosed in 2019. The downward slope of her progression through this disease has been dramatic. In the past 2 years she has become wheelchair bound, and is beginning to now show many signs of dementia. Biden’s gait and his demeanor do seem consistent with Parkinson’s, but I’m not a medical professional. He should be treated by a qualified neurologist to make that call, and if he is indeed suffering from Parkinson’s, hopefully he’ll realize he should step aside. I’ll say this though… the person I know, didn’t want to give up driving, or walking, or anything else she used to take for granted. We had to draw the line for her. Getting old sucks.
My father was diagnosed with Parkinson's along with Lew Body's dementia. His symptoms started out as irritability & neglect of normal activities & obligations. He went downhill quickly in the last 2-3 years & couldn't do anything by himself towards the end.
Sorry to hear it. One of my specialties. Most neurologists have no idea how to treat it.
My wife has Parkinson's now 8 years. It was bearable, but it does not disappear with levodopa. If Biden is a patient, he still is in an early stage.
Trump looks better, but he has no problem to be consistent or truthfull, so that makes his intellectual task easy.
I'm a retired RN with 35+years of experience in acute and critical care. I also think Joe Biden has Parkinson's and treatment is critical. Symptoms include flat affect, vacant stare,shuffling gait and tremors. His left hand was shaky during the debate. He exhibits all of these. How can he maintain for 4.5 more years? No need to list what's wrong with the "other guy"
I certainly respect your insight however I must vote Biden to save Democracy.
I'll stand in the rain to vote for Biden, however we will all lose. Biden simply cannot be the Democrat nominee, or the world will be plunged into a new horror show, the like of which hasn't been seen for 85 years.
Joe must go. There is no other way out.
I think the PD is being treated. The choice of his VP will matter.
There is no way his PD is being treated.
It is. Without treatment he would be worse. I am a physician but have not examined Biden, so I offer an educated guess only. Whatever, we need a younger qualified democratic candidate.
Why does he have to maintain it for 4.5 years? Why can't he get elected, pick a strong team, and keep going? And let the succession plan work the way it's supposed to work?
Please list your medical credentials. I’ll wait!
I am an MD and I agree. Sorry to make you wait Mary
You are right. I have said this for months. His gait is characteristic of Parkinsonism.
Clinically it's so obvious, and I didn't expect it to take so long to make the diagnosis. Not just his gait, but the blunting of facial expression, the unblinking stare, the poverty of movement, the soft voice. Above all, his confusion is not dementia, but the likely result of REM sleep disorder, a highly treatable condition.
His medical advice has been just appalling, and his doctor should have been dismissed long ago.
Assuming he has had this condition, untreated, for 2-3 years, his prognosis is good, on treatment, for several more years.
Now it's too late. For the sake of himself, his party, and above all the country and the world, he has to go.
At least this is a very valid medical reason for having him bow out, & a great excuse for replacing him. Do you have any medical credentials along with your compelling argument that would make it useful for you to try to persuade some people in high positions of power that Biden has Parkinson's & should be replaced?
Board-certified neurologist.
Look, he has parkinsonism, and he either has the common treatable form, or an untreatable variant. Either way, it's too late now for his political career, and he has to bow out.
The prognosis not not good. His choice of VP matters. Biden should allow another Democratic candidate to run for POTUS.
Oh, it does? What do you think of Biden's current VP choice? Why don't you SAY HER NAME? And why don't you openly discuss the concerns you may have about his current choice? Woman? Indian? Black? Prosecutor? Experience? What are your opinions about the current succession plan?
This is just insidious doubt-mongering. WHO are you anyway, to diagnose the man?
To steady the nation’s nerves at this juncture, and really wake things up, I’d like to see Obama as Biden’s vice-presidential running mate. He can supply the vigor and resilience necessary, and his experience would allow him to back up Biden to any extent needed or wanted. I don’t think it’s a banned choice, and there’s no one else I can think of in the country who could provide that experience and backup right now.
The diagnosis is right before your very eyes, Parkinsonian freezing and a Parkinsonian shuffle to name a few. Disorientation to person, place and time is another easy one. https://barryjkaufmando.substack.com/p/there-is-no-debate-democrats-are
Thank you for bringing this to our attention. If his team knows this, it’s absolutely shameful that they did not bring it to public attention and look for a new candidate. This is the first I've heard of it, and what I’ve been hearing from various channels is that he walks that way because of arthritis. If the president knows this and didn’t step down of his own accord, then he has really done us a disservice.
He may have arthritis, but that's not his main problem. I feel so sad about the situation. He's a very good president, and, in my opinion, has had very poor medical attention.
Of course, if he has resisted the diagnosis, and has refused treatment, then that is just appalling also.
STOP.
I suspect he has PD and it is being treated. He does not show signs of dementia, but he is too old for another 4 years. Trump would be worse. We need a new Democratic candidate.
I agree with you, Gerald. But who and how fast is the question. Hillary? Newsom? Jamie Raskin? I would vote for any of them.
Perhaps. But I think it more likely that he has advanced arthritis and/or degenerative disk/bone disease. That would be more in keeping with what we have been told. My Mother had this and she became so stiff she could barely get around; pain was constant and required much pain killers, which became harder to get. His speech issue has been life-long, but has gotten noticeably worse. He knows the facts and has good reasoning, but it doesn't cone out well under pressure, and his annunciation has gotten worse. He is still the better candidate by far.
Michael: My daughter - a nurse practitioner - says the same thing. Spot on. Sad.
He seemed much better when he appeared at the watch party after the debate. He also seemed to improve as the debate went on. My wife suspects a cold medication.
Jeepers! Biden is a decent and responsible guy. If he’s been diagnosed with PD I feel confident he’d bow out. I sense some “mob rule” here - not one of the comments is coming from anyone who has actually examined the President or who has access to his medical records. Slow down all the rumor-mongering please.
I’ve seen plenty of recent clips where he’s doing fine. He’s an old guy, true, but he’s OUR guy!
You don't think his doctors would know this if it were true, and he wouldn't be being treated for it? Didn't he have a physical recently and was declared okay?
The GOP has been dismantling our education system for decades, and have been assisted by the bleeding hearts. They have removed art, music, civics, and the far left insisted "everyone wins a prize," teach math 3 different ways because different children learn differently, and nobody gets lower than a "B" for a passing grade.
The dumber we get, the more honor roll students there seem to be!
If you want to fight, reach out to your local Democratic Town/City/County Committee. They have things you can do that will actually help - and you won't get arrested for assaulting anyone! LOL!
Have you ever watched your child year after year sit alone on a cafeteria floor after almost all the kids went up to the stage to get an award? I did and it was heart wrenching!
I have a child who is beautiful and amazing and was diagnosed incorrectly with a behavioral disorder in our wonderful AZ schools. She was never a problem child, but couldn't get good grades and prefered reading all the time. This diagnosis placed her in classrooms with kids who really struggled emotionally. She was finally diagnosed correctly at 16yo with autism in Wyoming.
When we moved to Washington, she was placed into an alternarive high-school that helped my daughter to graduate at 20yo. She didn't get awards for math or science excellence, but she was acknowledged for the skills she did have; elegance, diplomacy, empathy, compassion, and love of music and art. She was made to feel needed and important.
Now she is 26yo, getting the services she needs and going to college. She is deeply aware of politics and people. She is studying to be an ESL teacher because she is really good at languages and cultures and likes working with immigrants.
I was a conservative, but having worked with "far-left" people who brought my daughter out of her shell and made her a big shiny pearl is a gift that keeps on giving to this mom whose daughter used to ask me why she was so stupid, couldn't do anything right, and couldn't make her teachers happy.
Sit and ponder on that before you ignorantly attack professionals who are in the thankless but honorable work of fighting for all children's rights to prosper and flourish!
I'm sorry you're child was misdiagnosed. Two of my children are on the spectrum and I am grateful for programs that have helped make them wonderful, positive. contributing members of society. I also have 3 teachers, a school nurse and a guidance counselor in my family. I listen to them complain that they are given "directives" that if a student shows up for class, regardless if they are prepared or not, if they do work or not, they get a "B;" this is not for the child, this is to avoid issues with the parents who provide no accountability for their child and refuse to accept their child is not perfect. Teachers have been assaulted by parents, heck, teachers have been assaulted by students and parents have defended the students' actions as justified!
We are both speaking anecdotally, and while the left helped your daughter, I watched one of my other children be given math papers back with wrong answers marked correct; when I approached the teacher, she explained to me, that it was a subtraction paper, and although the answer was wrong, it was smaller, so my child understood it was "less than." Sorry, that may be an "A" for effort, but not an "A" in math.
Yep giving everyone a trophy is the best course of action. That way those who worked hard and got the good grades will notice that it did not matter and they might as well give up. Yep your answer is much better
Your response is just plain cruel. It's also way off base. People work hard and get good grades for intrinsic reasons, not for 'trophies'. Please learn something before spouting off your nonsense.
Really? So when awards are given out no one cares? I believe you are the one spouting nonsense
You have a sprawling Department of Education started by the incompetent peanut farmer and a special interest group called the Teachers Union run by a far-left wack-o that puts teachers before students and parents and you blame the GOP for dismantling the education system? DEI, CRT, boys in girls bathrooms....you've shot yourselves in the foot and have the temerity to call the GOP the villain?
Teaching to tests has destroyed independent thinking as well.
Absolutely! god forbid teachers use creativity to educate children. They think teachers should teach from a book, and students learn from a book. No need to go to a symphony concert, art museum, a local business to see how things are made, a living history museum, historical play, a french restaurant, or an aquarium (a few places I went on field trips as a student). By stressing out teachers and terrifying children with threats of being held back if they fail, those tests can take some credit for contributing to our "Anxiety Generation."
I find it insulting people who bash educators have no training in education. Many feel it is all someone else's fault. Most likely, it everyone worked together the child and parents would have it easier. When children don't have an easy time learning or are different blame is placed on teachers and school. People need to just work together because no one caused this. Work together and stop blaming helpers.
lol you blame republicans for the dumbing down of education but only point out what the left has done. Good job, on this we agree
There's plenty of blame to go around. I pointed out cutting programs and classes - that's what the right has done. The left has done it's share, and I pointed that out too.
Funny that you say Republicans have cut classes yet I live in Idaho (a very Republican state) and the kids have all those classes that you listed. What they don’t have is drag queen hour.
That's right, in Idaho there are no "drag queens." All you cowboys save your "non-conforming" sexuality for when you go on your Brokeback mountain excursions. either that, or you prove you're not gay by beating up young gay men and tying them onto barbed wire fences, leaving them to die like Matthew Shepard. Oh wait, those are both Wyoming - it's in Idaho where people believe that homosexuals have their sex organs in their mouths (cited source below). Have you ever been to a drag queen story time? These people are actors who read these stories with passion and inflection and personality that draws young children in and gets them involved in the stories. It doesn't make them gay; it makes them great listeners and early learners.
https://www.nailedmagazine.com/features/being-queer-in-idaho-by-tom-spanbauer
Find a common ground with your MAGA friend if any. Biden came up short with the end of our war in Afghanistan and with an unconstitutional inflationary attempt to forgive student loan debts. The
moveothe discussion o the greater reasons Biden is better despite his age and disability.
That is what it is. World peace is at stake. The U.S. had this responsability once, but this moron will make it all in vain.
I totally agree and feel the same way. That there are actually millions of people in our country who support - and seem to worship - a loathesome individual, a convicted felon, and a person who has spelled out all of the evil and vengeful, not to mention, dangerous things he will do (regarding relations with Russian, support for our allies and our commitment to help Ukraine), is so appalling, it's beyond understanding.
Of course the message is good. We can keep saying that until we’re blue in the face. For a long time, it hasn’t been about that. It’s about our messenger. It takes both—in fact, history shows a good messenger is the most important thing if you want to WIN.
Agree. The optics were atrocious.
It’s NOT the messenger. Focus on the message.
Good grief, woman! Open your eyes and ears and listen to what people are saying! Why Biden’s doctors aren't getting Biden the care he needs is unforgivable. Unless old Joe won't allow them to. WE ARE A PARTY WITHOUT A HEALTHY, HARDY MESSENGER, AND AS SUCH, BIDEN IS DOING THIS NATION A REAL WRONG! HE IS LEAVING US STRANDED AND UP A CREEK WITHOUT SO MUCH AS A CANOE! I HAVE BEEN SCREAMING AT THIS GROUP SINCE THE BEGINNING OF MY JOINING THAT BIDEN WAS A NON-STARTER! BURYING ONE'S HEAD IN THE SAND HAS GOTTEN US TO WHAT WE WITNESSED TONIGHT!
Another RBG
Who cares about the message of the messenger can’t wing?
Focus on the message? If that is your answer, then we are going to double loose. This is over. Step down biden.
I agree, like men dressing like women to get into girls locker rooms and bathrooms and to be able to read to little kids. Yes we have heard the message loud and clear
Good Lord, what is wrong with you?
The left says that they can define what a woman is and there is something wrong with me?
The left says it’s fine that men go into girls locker rooms and there is something wrong with me?
The left says it’s just fine to murder a child and there is something wrong with me?
They will call good evil and evil good
Oh Brad, I love your white male confidence to jump into a conversation about something else and vomit hate all over the place. Pretty on brand. Me thinks you may be a power bottom that is just self hating or wanting to wear some of those women's clothes?
Step down today biden.
Very true, Liz.
Yep having a senile old man be your messenger was not the best idea. But since when have we ever been able to tell leftist how wrong they are
Hear, hear. On the nail.
If this is your criteria, then you must be voting for someone else other than these two. Neither of these charlatans meet any of those.
Biden is not a charlatan.
And in just 5 words Mary, you've distilled the choice that's in front of us! For sure, they're both old, but one of them has well defined clinical pathology, & the other, he wants to help American's live a better life.
You might be right, a complicit in a genocide ought not be called a charlatan
Bob has turned into a sniveling pathetic ass kisser, no there there.
Who's "Bob"? Robert Reich, do you mean?
My question exactly! I don't know where she got that idea if that's who she's thinking of.
Hi Jamie, I can’t handle the animosity on these threads in this particular newsletter. I am going to shut down for the day. All the screaming and shouting about replacing Biden is not going to get us anywhere. The wise thing to do would’ve been to step down as he indicated he planned to do after four years. Then he changed his mind. It is quite possible that most of America did not watch this debate. The problem is that the news media is going to spin this against Biden in a big big way, and they are our worst enemy and an enemy of democracy.
Biden should have stepped down. He's accomplished a lot, but the truly noble act would have been to at least a year out help another great presidential team get ready to run and act.
I was saddened and stunned by Biden last night, expecting to see a performance equal to his State of the Union. Where was his tan? He looked wan and blank.
But it hasn’t lessened my support or resolve because many of us know that this choice isn’t between Biden and Trump but what they stand for.
VOTE BLUE, to save us, to reinforce democracy, our precious freedoms and civil rights.
Amen! I am with you. I would vote for Biden if he were 500 years old, over the evil-doer Trump. However, will that make a majority? We are in perilous times, for sure.
I was stunned last night, expecting the Biden from the State of the Union. It was sad and painful to watch.
Having said that, you are right, and my resolve to support the Democratic ticket is as strong as ever because our lives and way of life are at stake. My concern is all the many voters who are ambivalent about the two; their choice could doom our country.
Remember, the choice is between democracy and autocracy. Vote straight BLUE to save ourselves, future generations and our country.
This is the same mentality that has brought us to the debate we just witnessed. The continued sponsorship of two lesser evils still leaves us with evils. They say democracy dies in darkness. But what could be darker than the cloth being pulled over your eyes regarding who is running our country at the moment. Biden might be signing the checks, but who’s holding his hand at the time? And your list of false equivalents does nothing to help either side face the issues this country is facing. Did you even read the quotes Richard posted? You are the embodiment of the “public” who hasn’t been allowed to cool off and think clearly. Biden lies. Biden chooses war. Biden spreads division. But because Biden is doing it, you’re ok with it… because he’s “your guy”. Everyone needs to step outside their echo chambers and think critically about what is being done. When Trump was in office, he was excoriated for wanting to close the southern border. He was vilified for raising tariffs, by both the left and independents. But now Biden has finally done both those things and has been praised for it. A bad idea is a bad idea, no matter who does it. I’m not commenting on borders or tariffs as good or bad. I’m saying, blind faith isn’t faith. You can’t blindly follow “your guy” just because he’s not the “other guy”.
I'm sorry you feel this way, but I fully understand why. There is a great deal of truth and logic to what you said, and I concur with much of it - but what are we to do? These, indeed, are times that try our souls. I don't know about you, but I'm standing on a precipice, fighting a howling wind to stay alive. It is hard to sleep, eat, and stay healthy these days. Both candidates are far from acceptable but for extremely different reasons. There is no moral equivalency despite Biden's shortcomings. But Erica, there are times when pragmatism is more important than a genuinely righteous result. We cannot afford to let perfection be the enemy of good. I know there are better outcomes - but are they even remotely achievable in the time left given the damnable complexities of our current election system (is, electoral college, endless dark money, gerrymandering, etc.? You cant govern if you don't win. For what it's worth, my bottom line is this: its not about Biden or Trump anymore. They are inadequate placeholders in a nightmare election. But after what the most corrupt SCOTUS in history has done, we are no longer a democracy. We are a dictatorship and the only chance we have to survive this horror and save our children future at this moment is to commit to vote for Biden or his replacement on Nov. 5. Its democracy or dictatorship and right now dictatorship is winning. These are desperate times. I share your deep concerns and sense of doom. All we can do now is select the candidate that has the greatest chance of stopping Trump and if we prevail, then the truly hard work to renew and fix this damaged and dysfunctional nation begins. If Trump wins. Something that will never be possible again if Trump becomes the monarch SCOTUS has enabled him to be.
That's really overly simplistic. We already knew that Trump is unfit to be president, but unfortunately now we know that Biden is also unfit. Let's convince Biden to withdraw and find a new Dem candidate.
I will be writing postcards to voters in Wisconsin this morning. Last week was to Ohio. I will not stop fighting. 🌊💙
Agreed. But the question isn't who you or I will vote for, it is who will swing voters in the few deciding states vote for? How many potential Democratic voters will stay home due to lack of enthusiasm and not vote at all? That is what Biden's poor physical condition and debate showing has now put in jeopardy.
They just won't vote. Not who will they vote for?
What is funny is that if a Trump supporter said this he is part of a cult, but when a Biden supporter says it, it is just fine. This is called a double standard which leftist are good at
Oh Brad, you are a national treasure. I don't think you understand what the word cult means and it shows
Yes using the leftist standard you are in a cult. Unless you want to now change the definition of cult. Very possible since any time a leftist wants to do so thing they change the meaning of a word.
Funny how I simply used your sides standard and you don’t like it. But that is usual. The left never likes having their insane standards used against them
AMEN...you nailed it!! I'm sticking with democracy NOT fascism!
Excellent comparison.
Very well said! Yet, this list of words/choices will be perceived as gibberish to MAGAheads whose ability to comprehend anything other than what comes out of their fearless leader’s poisonous little mouth. For them, Trump’s lies are the only things they believe and put their money behind. Nevertheless, those of us with intact grey matter must continue a good fight to maintain our democracy. VOTE BLUE!
Just a wee suggestion ... switch the order of NATO or Putin 😉.
You were right to be worried Robert. We now have a 100-alarm fire and the DNC and beltway insiders seem still to be sleep-walking to a massive defeat… Those of us not in the inner elite circles feel so powerless and unheard.
It's not too late. Trump is a convicted felon and wannabe fascist. Biden does not have the energy to fight him. Gavin Newsom does.
I live in California, Erik and am a confirmed Democrat. Gavin Newsom is NOT Presidential material.
He would eviscerate Trump in a debate, but it is too late for that. And California has issues right now, as we both know. Newsom is not in a strong position. Whitmer is a better choice. Meanwhile, they've sidelined Kamala so badly, she could never get the support she would need. They created an utter mess and our nation will pay for it.
I'm afraid you may be right. :(
Whitmer or Pa's Shapiro.
Do you think the country is ready for a Jewish president?
I'm not sure, but Pa. is not California or NJ. And, they love him there, and it's a must-win state for the Ds. I didn't think this country was ready for a Black President either.
Not if the left has anything to do with it
Harris wasn't able to garner enough votes in the 2020 election on her own before becoming the VP running mate. She'd be steamrollered, and imo not convinced she's presidential material in any event. Don't like how she gave "Mr. Foreclosure" Steven Mnuchin a pass instead of prosecution back when CA's AG.
As a fellow Californian, I reluctantly endorse this statement.
That's not what I hear. As I see it, his candidate profile includes Executive experience, well spoken, intelligent, charismatic and Kennedy-esque appeal. His only downside is that CA is not a swing state. However, that didn't stop Nixon and Reagan from the WH. Why do you say GN is not Prez material?. IMO, nobody is perfect... Except MI Gov Gretchen Whitmer.
Or vote for RFK jr.
Newsom, like trump is a self interested, what's in it for me politician, he is also inclined to take the advice of the last man who spoke to him, much like the old King Stephen of England. A good choice is an intelligent well informed politician of any gender with the intelligence and concern for the common god above all else.
I disagree
You’re kidding right? I’m a Californian and I wish Gavin would have run. Anyone who already hates California and Newsom for no good reason is never voting Blue anyway.
Fay, tRump is presidential material? Biden's base is not going anywhere. Undecided voters will wake up to the fact that not voting or voting for a third party is a vote for tRump. And if they are bought into "the lesser of two evils" BS the lesser is Biden!! For those of us who follow politics find it unfathomable that the likes of a tRump could garner the support he does, which is a damning commentary on the American electorate
No trump is not and never will be presidential material That was exactly why the Federalist Society and Heritage Foundation chose him. There are certain people in any society who love clowns and even I will admit that trump is nothing if not a clown - not as good as Emmet Kelly - but still a clown. I got the biggest laugh last night when he talked about acing the two cognitive tests - they were cognition at the sixth grade level - big whopping wow. I'd place his real IQ between 90 and 110 - within the rank of average intelligence.
Both Newson and CA are hated, literally reviled, in the heartland. Seen as the epitome of unctuous Dem elite. Gretchen Whitmer has won by double digits in MI. Not sure why that political effectiveness and ability to connect with swing voters isn’t the primary consideration?
California is certainly not held in esteem on the East Coast, who equate California with Hollywood (which I personally experienced when traveling the East Coast on business assignments) - trust me there's a lot more to my State than Los Angeles County, which I personally avoid.
Newsom isn't hated. And he is not a "bad" man in the sense that trump is a "bad" man. He is not Presidential material, because he is more self interested than common good interested.
From what I have seen and heard I think Gretchen Whitmer is a good politician. I'm not sure American are willing to give up their macho cowboy image they so crave. Kamala Harris would probably be better suited to the Presidency with her terrific background and experience plus the invaluable training she has received from Joe Biden. But Kamala has two strikes against her - gender and skin color whereas Gretchen only has gender.
So does Pete Buttigieg.
Pete is awesome but too many homophobes in the US, even among Dems, to give him a realistic chance of winning.
lol actually it comes down too Pete has done nothing to warrant anyone voting for him. I guess someone who is a mayor of a little town that can’t even fill pot holes would be better for the Dems than the senile old man running now
Pete is doing a spectacular job at DOT-Sec.
lol tell that to Ohio
My thoughts turned to Mitch Landrieu and Cory Booker. Both showed outstanding leadership as mayors of big cities with big problems. But there are many other possibilities.
Forget about Cory Booker….a lovely guy but this is a brass knuckles kind of fight and it is not in him……
I don’t know Landrieu, but Booker turned his back on public education as mayor. He would not be my choice.
Yes there is Pocahontas she could run.
Ugh… Thinkum Pocahontas needum go back to teepee, drinkum more firewater & stealum more wampum from young Native American kids trying to get intoum good colleges…
I like Corey Booker too, he's done well as a senator. in addition to being a mayor
4 months before the election is absolutely too late. There is a whole campaign apparatus that cannot be spun up in a few weeks.
Isn't VP Harris part of the the "campaign apparatus?" She's wouldn't be my first choice, but she's light years better than Trump, and if she had a running mate, like Joaquin Castro, they could bring back the Black and Latino voters who are sliding toward Trump. I do think it's too late for Gavin Newsom, no matter what one might think of him, though as a Californian I think he'd otherwise be just fine.
That's not how campaigns work. The payroll is handled out of campaign coffers and needs to be set up via specific legal processes. Thousands of people need to be hired, given background checks, and put into offices. A candidate cannot just take over someone else's campaign staff and offices, and phone bills, and ....
It's a HUGE undertaking, and has to be done at both state and federal levels. It takes months.
Just campaigning would be absurdly difficult. Getting to all 50 states in 18 weeks would be hard, but that would only give one campaign rally per state. Candidates need to campaign multiple times, at different times of day, in different cities, on weekdays and weekends, in order to make sufficient outreach to enough voters in a state. That can't happen with the time available.
Ballots are already printed in some places, and those would have to be re-done, but I guarantee that the GOP fight, hard, prevent them from being updated (like they did - successfully - in the NH primary) and that would result in the new candidate not even being on the ballot.
There are hundreds or thousands of ways that it's simply not going to work to try to get a new candidate on the ballot now.
I would have preferred someone else as a candidate. I preferred someone else in 2020, too. But we're beyond the point where we can switch candidates, now, strictly from a logistical standpoint.
Here are some additional insights from the political perspective that are probably worth considering as well: https://sethabramson.substack.com/p/the-extremely-simple-reason-maga
lol Harris is no one’s first, second, or third pick
Gavin Newsom is a horrible choice as a candidate. He has literally run California into the ground.
That is a big fat lie. I live here, and gee, California has not been "run into the ground." And, Sally O'Brien is correct. This is not the time or place to argue about Newsom.
lol when people are leaving California like rats from a sinking ship and businesses are fleeing your state, yes he has run it into the ground
You're right. The one-party rule in California has "run it into the ground". It's a Democratic party wet-dream. Imagine it running the country.
No, it is not. A budget swing from around 100 billion in the black to around 45 billion in the red in one year, billions spent on the homeless problem with no accountability or improvement, lax laws and lack of enforcement leading to a significant crime problem, excessive taxation, highest gas prices in the nation, and the hypocrisy of his behavior during the pandemic. He is a pure politician - nothing more.
This is not true at all, but this is not the time or place for that debate.
If the Democratic party had recognized that Biden was going to be too old to run again and had begun promoting legitimate alternative candidates years ago, there would not be a need to debate alternatives at this point.
Considering we have been saying that long before he ran the first time. But if he comes out the second time and does even a tiny bit better than he did this time your party will have amnesia and rally behind him again
I like Newsom. We also have to realize that our candidate has to battle not just Trump, but the entire Christofascist plot to end our democracy. Our current enemies are legion, but I’ll name some of them: Leonard Leo, chairman of the Federalist Society, and mentor to the six Reich-wing, religiously fanatic activists currently on the Supreme Court, and co-author of Project 2025, and the Heritage Foundation, co-author of Project 2025.
Yep and we have seen the dumpster fire he has in California
Totally agree with you, Erik. I would vote for Newsom also. He could trounce Trump in a debate and hopefully excite enough of the Dems and uncommitted to win. I also love Jamie Raskin. This is going to sound odd, but a Raskin/Liz Cheney ticket would excite me.
Not the best candidate by any means. I rate him no better than Bill Clinton. We have better prospects: Jamie Raskin, Elizabeth Warren, Jeff Merkley, Sheldon Whitehouse, Cory Booker, Pete Buttigieg...
lol your list is the who’s who of the loony left. Clinton was the untouchable until the left decided they could not use him anymore
Their intellect is far above yours if that's what you think. I've never liked nor voted for Clinton.
lol a monkey has more intelligence than your list. You may not have liked Clinton but the rest of your party idolized him until the messiah came along and won in 08’
Jamie has health problems, Elizabeth or SHELDON would be best
Looks like Raskin has overcome his problem with cancer & has been looking quite robust lately.
He will absolutely kill the down ballot. They must do something now, but unfortunately, there's little time and Biden's family, including Jill will cling to the notion he can still win in this state and not convince him to do the right thing. If anything, the convention will be chaos now.
Liz, We can be heard if we organize. As a start, I would suggest we read NYTIMES Editorialist Thomas L. Friedman’s heartfelt piece “President Biden Is My Friend. He Must Bow Out of the Race” posted June 28th, 2024 1:57 a.m. ET.
I also would note, as I scrolled through this thread and observed several replacements under discussion, my mind kept circling back to two governors whom I believe would make the strongest ticket our Party could deliver: Wes Moore of Maryland and Gretchen Whitmer of Michigan. Still, I believe we would best be served were a roster of highly qualified candidates afforded the opportunity (there’s still time) to battle for the nomination.
Whitmer yes. Moore has very little experience as a Gov. Let's she how he does. MD is not a swing state like MI.
Danny While your concerns regarding Moore’s short tenure to date as Governor are legitimate, a quick look at his Wikipedia page referencing his work as Governor might allay some of your apprehension. Moreover, I would note that Republican former Governor of Maryland Larry Hogan’s bid for a Senate seat very much makes the race for this open seat a swing election.
Are you against RFK because you would have to admit that you are a bit of a moron? I get it. Maybe just stfu for a couple days and galvanize a thought. Currently you look silly.
Gretchen Whitmer would probably be the most viable candidate right now. There are other options I would heartily support - Booker and Buttigieg come first to mind - but with her record governing Michigan, Whitmer could step in and immediately take charge.
This is why I'm not a Dem even though I've never voted Republican and never will.
Plausible deniability? What a joke
Chuck you can do better than that.
So then you’re not voting for Biden or the Dem candidate everytime?
That would be a non sequitur. Explain your logic.
“I am not a Dem…” but will only vote for Dems. Well sorry but that makes you a dem
Again, a non sequitur. You seem to have an inability to think outside your box.
Terry , we get it . You’re a stupid finger pointing little bitch. You can stop talking circles now. We are deep enough in to the comments that no one is reading.
So someone says, “I am not a Trump supporter but will only vote for Trump…” yep a non sequitur
This answer should be viewed as the thinking in a spiritual lens framework: our country is on the verge of internal consummation because of universal, narrow selfishness enhanced by a raging materialism and disregard for those who have less. I believe in a God who loves us beyond description, but who is beyond distressed at our total ignorance of the messages sent by those who have moved on to an eternal life: Our Lady at Lourdes and Fatima warned the world what would happen if we did not change our priorities. I am afraid that the time has come to pay the piper. The Biden-Trump debacle is Exhibit "A" of a choice's consequences we all made decades ago.
It has come to this: we must reconcile with Our Lord and eternity - - or Armageddon awaits.
Definitely, Liz.
Look to Michigan
Look to Kentucky
Steve beshear
Sad night indeed. Biden could and should have said he is happy to debate Trump as soon as he finally concedes the election. Instead they normalized him again tonight. CNN appears to not have learned a thing in those trump years. And why Biden apparently would want to compete with trump playing golf will for ever stay a riddle to me. Sad night.
CNN continues to push Trump. They let him get away with not answering questions.
So right. I found the moderation extremely poor, whether deliberately so or not. Trump was given far too much leeway to talk gutter tripe, avoid answering direct questions and pontificate on what *he* had achieved when in office, which waslargely, if not all, lies.
It was a debate, not an article. CNN not to blame. Step down biden.
Is there a point to your comment? Who claimed that it was an article rather than a debate? It certainly wasn't me. CNN's moderators did an extremely poor job. Others have suggested implicit bias in that moderation, I didn't but wouldn't rule it out.
My point is pretty clear and until you lay the blame where it is... with biden, we have no hope because you are enabling someone who will lose and we all saw it a year ago.
Your post was flawed.
"It was a debate, not an article." - I did not say it was an article and, to the best of my knowledge, neither did anyone else.
"CNN not to blame." I did not 'blame' CNN, though there are many who consider it to be a biased company, as indeed are most mainstream media organisations. What I wrote was that "I found the moderation extremely poor, whether deliberately so or not." That is true. I did not even 'blame' the moderators, giving them the benefit of the doubt in the last 5 words of the sentence I've just quoted.
"Step down biden" - is an opinion and offers nothing at all, being without explanation, context or justification.
As for your latest post - I don't consider it useful to "blame" for it achieves nothing. Even where I to be judgmental and all-knowing enough to lay blame, in this case I can see nothing for which to castigate Biden.
I am unable to predict the future and doubt that you are, either. However, I will not abandon a cause simply because it falters for I will not give encouragement to those who oppose that cause.
I know of no evidence to support your generalist assertion that "we have no hope" - who is "we?" ... "because *you* [i.e. me] are enabling someone who will lose" - Am I? I wasn't aware that I had such power and certainly can't imagine that, being a relatively poor, non-voting, observer, I have the ability to "enable" anyone in this election. "someone who will lose" - there we have yet another indication of your false assumption that you can predict the future. "...we all saw it a year ago." - Yet again the undefined but this time absolutist "we" which is neither accurate or even sensible.
So, at best, your "point", if it could be seen to deserve such a title, is nothing more than a personal bias, without substance, that makes false claims, assumes facts that are demonstrably untrue and offers nothing of use or relevance to the main topic of this thread.
I have read other comments of yours and it is clear that this is your bent, i.e. to write uniformed, unsupported, false assumptions which, at best, serve only to promote a personal view that is simplistic and offers litte to nothing of value to the issue at hand.
I respect your right to free speech but suggest that you use it when you have something useful to contribute rather than simply to air your foolishness in public.
what did the mods even do? any monkey could just pose the questions.
They also let him ramble on. I'm sure he exceeded the time limits at least a few times, but he was never called on it, whereas Biden was cut off.
I timed every response and Trump finished on time except for one instance. They let him keep responding, though. As well, they permitted Trump to NOT answer the question and instead pontificate with lies. Very bad for CNN.
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
Thanks for letting us know.
I felt the same way. Indeed, now I wish I'd timed the dialogue myself.
I wish the same.
Agree. A very sad night.
Trump is from Seinfeld's "bizzaro world." Trump claimed the economy is good because he "cut regulation." Trump really believes that jobs are created by cutting regulation. In fact, Biden created jobs by investing in infrastructure. Despite cutting regulation to create jobs, Trump said Biden would make America a 3rd World country. Welcome to Trump's Bizzaro World that CNN normalized by not following up on Trump's repeated lies.
It wasn't up to CNN. They both knew the rules. A strong debater would have wiped the floor with demagogue Trump.
Had CNN weighed in to bail Joe out it would have been an even bigger disaster. I thought they did a reasonable job of trying to stay out of it. The sad truth is that Biden is well into dimentia. That should have been apparent before the ossified Democratic Establishment backed him. They pulled the same shit in bulldozing Sanders in favor of Hillary with all of her baggage. Now it's far too late, and God help us.
LeMoine, I do not agree that Biden is well into dementia. He has never been a good communicator, has always stuttered (which can be misinterpreted as dementia), and he was ill last night. I am 78 and last month had a terrible cold for over 10 days. During that time, there is no way I could have debated anyone! Give the man a break. He is human after all. There are plenty of speeches he has given this past year that are perfectly cogent.
So sick of the over 70 crowd claiming... he was just this or that, show him empathy. He had one job last night failed miserably and empathy is going to lose us the election. Step down biden.
I think you allow your own biases to prejudice your opinion, at least as far as your comment is concerned. Incidentally, there is no chance that 'God' will help "us" or should I say, it is the most improbable notion I've heard today, even after listening to Trump's tirade of lies and abuse, because there is not one example in history of 'God' ever having helped anyone. On the contrary, when it comes to either human made or natural disaster or suffering, 'God' is inevitably absent.
I used the phrase loosely. OK? Please, don't allow pedantry to overrun your otherwise reasonable commentary here. You know absolutely nothing of my "biases". If my use of the word "god" lit your fuse, I'm sorry.
Thank you for your response.
I am not a pedant.
I didn't claim to know your biases. I wrote that I of what I thought must be operative based on the content of your post.
It wasn't so much your reference to 'God' that caused my response to you but rather your personal opinions, bereft of evidence, regarding Biden's "dimentia" (sic) and other allegations about Democratic Party actions.
Take care. Stay safe. ☮️
You're probably correct but which face of God you asking for help - meek and mild face or wrathful destruction if you piss on his wall face?
I understand that "god" doesn't give a shit.
Any new Demo candidate would need to be an experienced debater, who can bulldoze through a blizzard of lies with a command of the interaction. Who is capable of that? Few people. A bright thinker who handles himself with aplomb. Who is not stigmatized with mindless support of genocide? Who also has a progressive history of support for poor and middle class needs? I wish I knew the name of such a person, but you smart people should be able to come up with one. Many people have one or two of these properties, but all of them?
Jamie Raskin & Elizabeth Warren.
If Biden does have Parkinson's, then I hope he steps down for his own health. Several people seem opposed to Gavin Newsom, but with name recognition being important, superior debate skills necessary and a limited amount of time for the other side to undermine him, makes him the best choice. Plus, he has the looks that literally attract people. Whitmer is great, but she needs a year or two on the national stange for people to get to know her.
I have a modicum of respect for Newsom and the things he's been able to accomplish, but you've obviously never been anywhere in the Midwest. "Don't California my <state>" is a major slogan in the Midwest and South. Newsom would be an even bigger liability than Biden on the national stage, simply because of the extremely poor view of California and "those left-coast LIBZZZZZ!!!!" in states that actually matter. He's a non-starter nationally, and thankfully he seems to realize that.
I believe the accepted term is "Californicate" ;-)
Governors Gretchen Whitmer or Josh Shapiro.
They did not push trump. This is a problem of our own making. Until you realize this, we will lose. Trump won last night.
CNN pushing Trump😂😂😂 wow that is hilarious
They may have become dominated by pig money.
When you have nothing significant to say, it is better to say nothing.
I don’t care who wins a golf game and don’t think it proves ability to govern.
I agree. It has always puzzled me that humanity has such a preoccupation with trying to hit balls into holes, as though it were some superb achievement. No, I'm not anti-sport nor anti ball games, I admit that I much enjoy soccer but that doesn't alter my wondering about our obsession with such games, nor the glorification of many who play them. (Though, in that respect, perhaps I'm just jealous because I had to work for a living, not having any talent for game playing. - And before someone yells, yes, I do understand that many athletes in all manner of sport put in long and arduous time in training and only a very small number are actually rewarded very well. - However, that's another issue for another time.)
Take care. Stay safe. ☮️
As a child I watched ants playing soccer on a sidewalk for hours. Still haven't puzzled out the rules of that game, Non Sibi. Now "American" football is a whole different game, as chess is to checkers. But as you say, that's a discussion for a different day. Good night. democracy. 🥱
Naomi--All it proves is Trump has lost his balls in someone else rough.
Well Naomi, the electorate is not you. Biden needs to step down. He should not have been the candidate anyhow
Really? I didn’t realize that.
Exactly. I’ll never understand why the hell a known liar, rapist and convicted felon was given the time of day as if he was a normal candidate. America is broken.
America is broken, but pragmatically you need a president who can put a sentence together most often he speaks. Step down biden.
I find it extremely interesting that CNN’s post debate commentary has been almost entirely about teeing up the idea of replacing the Biden/Harris ticket at the convention, but the DNC and the Biden campaign are apparently still not thinking that way.
No pun intended, I assume - given the golf comments here. :-)
Excellent point.
Everybody, calm down. It wasn’t great for Joe, but it wasn’t terrible. He steadied himself and hit his marks. TFG prevaricated and deflected his way through it; viewers know that. He came out strong but then showed his true colors and weakened and then flailed. The format was without fact checking and, therefore, flawed. Nothing much has changed. It’ll be okay.
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
You are blind. This is over and was 100% preventable. Step down biden. The votes won't go to Trump, they just won't vote.
I LOVE Joe - a great man, but it was terrible.
You're whistling pass the graveyard. But, I urge you to continue.
Biden did well. His stutter slowed and muttered his speech a bit, but he was uttering a mile a minute worth of detail. Volume on CNN needed adjustments. I will take experience, wisdom, patience, and stability anyway and everyday for the rest of my life over a dictator even for one day, not one single minute. FU Donnie, America has always been great because the people are great, not because of your bloated ass.
The judgment of Biden's symptoms of ageing is nothing more than ageism. In my view, it is as bad as judging the capabilities of someone with epilepsy, an amputation or some other difference as being incapable of intelligent and reasoned thought.
So, occasionally he slips up or loses his train of thought. So do I and have done for years. I also failed virtually every subject at high school yet I now have three degrees and have taught in schools, technical education and university.
I also found it extremely distasteful that Trump continually, with his usual abominable rabid style, spoke of migrants coming from "mental institutions" and being "insane". The vast majority of those who have some form of mental dysfunction, from the slight to the severe, are otherwise perfectly capable and productive members of society. If Trump was equally so, he would recognise that. That he doesn't suggests, on the basis that it 'takes one to know one', that it is more likely that Trump is the one with a real problem, not anyone who has been in a mental institution.
Trump doesn’t belong in a mental institution, he belongs in jail. And the fact that I saw this piece of sh it on tv tonight makes me want to vomit.
💩🤮
💩
"Ageism"? The poor man was feeble. It broke my heart. And it terrifies me for the November election.
Yes, ageism. That's what it is.
I have post-polio syndrome and have had to use a walking stick to get around for the last 12 years - yes, I feel feeble and may look it but my mind works as well as ever. Biden's performance over his term has been excellent and the nation is in a far better state now than when he came to office. That he has achieved as much whilst operating with a hostile and obstructionist Congress majority doing Trump's bidding, is testament to his worth.
I agree that he wasn't the youthful, dynamic and cutting figure such as was JFK in the first televised debate but that doesn't mean he's not capable.
Your reply is heartening! Thank you.
kdsherpa, no, thank *you*, it is heartening always to find someone who can accept a criticism or contradiction or another point of view and actually consider it, let alone consider it useful or worthwhile.
So, thank you.
take care. stay safe.
Biden's mind is NOT working well. So obvious.. denial is not reality.
"Denial is not reality" - not sure what that's supposed to mean. "Denial" is very real, as is evidenced frequently by Trump's rhetoric.
You may consider it "obvious" that Biden's mind is *not*, (no need to shout, I can read), working well but that doesn't make it so. Indeed, his performance during his term of office so far indicates quite the contrary.
Sad to disagree on Biden's handling of GAZA. He lied tonight saying Hamas has not agreed to BIDEN's Deal which Biden claimed was Israel's deal.. Israel the day following Biden's pronouncement, said it had to "finish the job" and had not agreed to what Biden represented as coming from Israel. Hamas wants a permanent ceasefire, not one of those partial ceasefires that puts civilians back in the murder zone after some hostages are released. On this alone, I cannot forgive Biden. It is genocide with American made bombs and billions in armaments. I would not have voted Biden or Trump. Jill Stein is my candidate.
If only you were right.
I agree that it was hard to watch Biden because I have spent the past 4 years watching full clips of his speeches and interviews and he really wasn't himself tonight. But, I do want to point out that Fox and MSNBC reported that he has a cold. Being that my entire family has been suffering with nasty colds, sore throats, strep and I currently have COVID, I'm inclined to believe this might be true. Please mask up if you're sick and in public or just stay home!
The problem is that people would think he had other problems. The entire thing is purely horrible for this wonderful President.
YES! The continuous slurs toward immigrants were horrendous and I wish Biden had dealt with that better, starting with the fact that we are a nation of immigrants. Trump was “dog whistling” white supremacy with those screeds against immigrants and should have been shut down.
Omg. Seriously, wake up. Step down biden.
This thread has become so convoluted I'm not sure whether your comment is really aimed at me or not. However, whether it is or not, it is a superficial and pointless opinion.
Thank you ! U are the only petson who brought up his speech disorder. Hes had it his whold life just like the King of England. It xan be crippling
He is an inspiration.
Things that are irrelevant... he looked feeble, empathy won't get young people to the poles.
I agree, but tonight a more urgent issue is before us. Biden lost tonight, and I fear he lost the election tonight. I think Biden must step down and let another candidate be selected at the convention. He has been a wonderful public servant, and I am grateful to him for everything he has done for us (except limit Anita Hill's corroborating testimony) which probably gave us Justice Thomas). But, now, for the good of the country, he must step down.
Biden is not senile. He has a lifeling severe stuttering problem he has had his entire life and has therapy for. My 32 yr old daughter talks exactly like this
It went deeper that that. His head wasn't working right.
Phoebe and Suzanne, I agree. My comments about Biden below do not include his stuttering. This, by itself, is not a game changer. For me, it was the general energy level and the slow response to challenge. I could tell that when he was answering policy questions, his mind tried to remember details that he had rehearsed with his debate prep team. This is understandable with all the details of new policies that Biden has put in place. But the slow responses were also compared with the rapid-fire response of Trump who, of course, when addressing policy, outright lied. Biden just was not up to all this. Confronting Trump is a difficult roe to hoe. But this is why Prof. Reich's quotes at the beginning of his post are so important. It takes someone very experienced in debate performance to counter this.
Have you ever seen someone with severe stuttering? This is classic stuttering. Not mild. Stuttering is a neurological disease that affects the part of the brain that manages oral speech. They know what they want to say. The words dont come out. They thought my daughter was mentally deficient & insisted on her being in special ed. In her senior yr a therapist worked with her and dhe graduated in regular school with honors. Have u ever lived with someone with severe stuttering???
Do you know who arranged the debate? The time, place & format of the debate? Biden brought this on himself. And 1 of the main things people were looking for in this debate was verifying which, if either, of the candidates fit the description of cognitive decline that both sides were claiming about the other side. Unfortunately, it was Trump that was more articulate & in charge. The only salvation for Biden is that any knowledgeable person paying any attention to what Trump was saying could see he was lying throughout the debate & saying some horrifying things.
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
I find it incomprehensible that Biden's handlers thought it would be a good idea to put him into a televised debate. Biden has been the 'safe pair of hands' for decades, even before VP to Obama, but he was never considered any good in public, despite the occasional well-written speech.
It can be no surprise that an 80-year-old Biden was never going to be any better, but it was a sad spectacle last night and it is now so obvious to everyone - Biden MUST stand down.
Jacquelyn - agree with your trying to remember what he had rehearsed analysis. All those prep days left no room for spontaneous response. But then his "handlers" were totally afraid of spontaneous response. It is what it is. Now what?
So, you could read President Biden’s mind?
He is fighting a cold and his voice was hoarse, according to a post debate discussion on NPR.
His whole approach was imbecilic, where Trump roared and Biden pecked back with stammering statistics. No fire to emphatically say Trump was full of shit. Someone called it the evil and the feeble.
Both Fox and MSNBC said Biden has a cold right now. Being that my family has spent the past 2 weeks sick with a nasty cold, strep throat and I have COVID, I'm inclined to think that is true. It's rough out there right now. Mask up if you are sick in public please or just stay home!
Phoebe. He looks feeble and incompetent and that is how he is seen fair or not. We need to win, and biden lost the election last night if he continues.
So, choose between a qualified old man, or Hitler 2.0 then
Joe is only 3 yrs older than TFG. Everyone assumes senility just because hes 81. He is mot senile. Try living with this disorder
Human beings will always solve the pragmatic threat before the existential one. The pragmatic threat is that our current president looks like he had a stoke. That is more pragmatically important than an existential crisis. I hate democrats today. This was avoidable.
Actually, Biden was also pro-Vietnam War ( an anomaly among Dems even then), pro-Iraq War, pro-policies that led to mass incarceration of Blacks, etc. He does love power and the adoration that comes with it, but that has its dark side, which we are seeing play out.
I don’t think so. Those past events have nothing to do with our current situation.
I was responding to the comment about AH being his only big misstep.
He was not pro Vietnam. Stop spreading that malinformation. He stated in his book that he thought the protestors were being aholes at the time for breaking into the college offices, but his record in Congress was against the war.
I agree with you no matter what anyone else responds. Anyone who would try to become president for 30 whole years has a POWER problem.
Was ralph nader power hungry? TFG has talked about being president since the 1970s
Agreed!
Thank you!
So, we have it confirmed for us (as if we did not already know): Joe is old, Trump is a louse. Speaking just for me, I'll take the honest mumbler over the snappy liar. Tough to sell to other folks, though.
"I'll take the honest mumbler over the snappy liar. " ... has potential as a bumpersticker!
A pretty damning one . . .
No disagreement here…..just fearful cause I live in north Atlanta suburbs where Biden won GA I. 2020 cause 30,000 Republicans opted NOT to vote for Trump allowing Biden to Win GA with less than 12,000 votes!! 7 states, and a universe of 500,000 voters will decide who are next president is going to be…..and Joe was trailing in each of those states before tonight’s disastrous performance……we need to get real NOW or we will all be crying in our soup come Election Day when the pyscho is announced the victor!! ☹️
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
Please stop repeating this . . . We get it already!
You are avoiding reality
Joe Biden can debate so long as he is not concerned with providing statistical proof of his accomplishments. And he needs to begin every answer with a reminder to the audiences that “the Republican candidate is a rapist, fraud, thief and a liar.”
Agreed but the fact that he can’t figure all this out and do it is on him….look the man has accomplished more than folks like me will ever accomplish in my lifetime….so kudos to him….but we are all mortal and being President ages all —see Obama See George W. bush — and they were much younger than Biden is now!! It’s a the crushingly unfair part of being human!! Life is short and anyone living at the level of being president ages even faster!! That he his family and his close associates don’t or won’t see that is what is truly tragic….
This debate highlighted the worst of both candidates.
CNN’s decision not to fact-check the candidates in real-time means that the only person who could dispel Trump’s incessant lies on live television was Biden, who seemed unable to keep up with the pace of the debate.
CNN Anchors, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash, did not keep Trump on topic.
CNN allowed Trump to bulldoze through several topics with nonstop lies and bluster and without interruption for the duration of his speaking time, which you could argue is not really productive.
To date, only two people have successfully interviewed Donald Trump: Jonathan Swan and Chris Wallace. They both used the same technique: (1) They brought paper receipts. (2) They aggressively challenged Trump’s extraordinary lies. (3) They refused to move on.
Thank you for that insightful take! 👏
It's a form of elder abuse, sadly.
George, how many times did you vote for Bill Clinton, he had the same resume you just cited.
I voted for Bill Clinton 2x. He may have a similar resume as Trump to an extent but he was accountable and owned up to it. Trump hasn’t owned up to anything. And the GOP-Trump policies of no tax, no regulation is exactly what we don’t need. Democratic policies made this country great…..not GOP non government policies.
Oh George, you're comedy gold.
Which he is not going to do . . .
Oh, ye of little faith. Biden did not have to sing a Puccini aria tonight, but he did miss a few opportunities to refute Trump’s lies.
Still, being president does not mean he must give answers that take two minutes to formulate on every issue. Being president takes far more than what one narrow and mostly insignificant measure like a sterile presidential “debate” with a cold and a stutter against a lying felon requires.
I’m not hedging his abilities on such a measure. I’m betting on his experience, integrity, affinity for the truth, his sense of respect and decency, and his ability to surround himself with the best people for the jobs that governance requires. Only the short-sided judge him on tonight.
We don’t assess success on one criterion. As president, Biden is thoughtful and considers all the details and evidence. Debates require ultrafast thinking and sometimes reckless pivoting. That’s not something I want in a president anyway. Obama was a great speaker, but Biden has been a far better president even in just his first term than his former boss was in two. And as I recall, Obama tanked on his first debate.
I am appalled at how many are so quick to throw this man under a bus just because of one stupid debate that wasn’t even a debate: Trump lied and bloviated without producing a shred of evidence to back up his claims. Biden never was a strong speaker, so why would we be surprised that he did not exude over-confidence? This debate isn’t a requirement to run the country—sound and solid knowledge and experience are definitely required. Biden more than fits the bill. You all should be ashamed of yourselves.
Here, Here!!! I love Joe Biden and I also love Kamala Harris. Biden has been mentoring her well and putting her to work all over the world and US. I would be very happy to see her as President, should the good Lord call Biden home! So we have an FDR-Truman situation. We can live with that! What we can't live with is a white Christian Nationalist theocracy ruled by an antichrist! I'm a Christian and I'm already planning my exodus from this country if Trump takes over. I don't want to be forced to worship this brand of Christianity.
You are wrong. He lost the election right now for young and undecided. This is over. Step down biden. Most of the electorate is short cited. Get out of your tower and into the streets
The election isn’t until November. The young and undecided can be reached with grass roots initiatives. Roll up your sleeves and do the work.
I almost can't wait for him to lose so you can hear me say... I told you so. Young people won't be reached by grass roots and moved to vote. They will just pass. There, I told you so. People like you are enabling an adict, which is the democratic party believing it's own crap and ignoring what is in front of them.
You obviously have a lot of trauma to deal with. Are you a disgruntled Bernie-supporter?
Lisa, we all need to be realistic! What you have written here is very profound and effective, but IF Biden truly has Parkinson's and everyone surrounding him is keeping it under wraps, then that is another story. Do YOU have the inside story??
Parkinson’s isn’t even on the radar, but maybe you have an inside story? The bottom line is he was able to speak lucidly and with intent a good portion of the evening. It was said he had a cold. I can tell you that when I’m sick, I do not always perform my best.
Dear Professor Reich:
Thank you for your comments this evening.
Unfortunately, I feel that the far-right fascists have been working to dismantle our democracy for years. How can we stop this evil plot? I feel discouraged.
Get a bumper sticker like mine, Beware Project 2025
Most ‘Muricans don’t even know what Project 2025 is, and if you told them, they would reply, Fake News.”
Unfortunately true! Most people are very uninformed
Mary, you are correct -- the far-right have indeed been working to dismantle our democracy. But to counter this, we need a person who projects the strength to turn this situation around, convince the American electorate that THEY CAN DO IT, and then get elected. I'm sorry to say that I don't think Biden is up to the task.
It WAS Bernie Sanders.
Too late.
Bernie Sanders could've given everybody hell and had things running smoothly. Throw Elizabeth Warren into the mix . . . Oh how the "Dems in charge" botched everything!
Unfortunately, the far-left fascists have been working to dismantle our democracy for years here in California with a single party rule by the DNC. Our state has become the Peoples Republic of California.
“Far-left fascists”? Is it possible to be a “far-left” fascist? I’m a Californian, Go, DNC!!
I’m proud to live in California. Go to Alabama or some other southern hellhole if you don’t like it here.
I lived in California for 15 years. (SF Bay Area) Best protections for the consumer, first to put laws in place protecting environment on and on. I miss CA when I visit…brings back good memories.
Yep. Porter Cologne—California’s Clean Water Act, which the Feds borrowed heavily from when the nationwide Clean Water Act was drafted and put into effect in the late 1960s/early 1970s. I’m a California native and very proud to live here.
I am in Alabama and wish so much I could move. Financially prohibited now . ..and I am hmm.. elderly. There are all kinds of people in every state. But in the Southern states there are so many Trumpsters.Ive spent some time in Africa and believe me that does NOT necessarily make me a popular white female. It’s daunting here..
Wow most people don’t like to live in filth. But you must have lived in it so long that you like it. But I don’t live in California and have intently made sure that whatever decisions I made never had me end up there
Your loss; our gain.
Not my loss at all. I would not go to the land of communism
Schwarzenegger was a Republican, stupid.
Your point is? Are you saying he was a Fascist?
Fascist normally includes words Far-RIght added to single person, party or group government rule.
I simple make the point that a "single party or group controlling government" can be defined as either Far Left or Right. Either moving toward Communism or moving toward Dictatorship. Fascist does not have to be one person but rather a single party/group seeking control.
Fascism is by definition, right wing you idiot
Fascism is defined as a “single person, party or group government rule” and yes, normally as of Far-right Nationalist believe. After further thinking, You’re correct, Fascist party central government rule is the Far-RIght, to what the Communist party central government rule is the Far-Left.
Using only those terms, I was searching for a label to our single person, single party government rule that California has experienced for most of these past 35 years.
Example; California’s top two candidate voting rule. Halving single party rule the choice in most, if not all elections is between two democrat's!
Why would ANYONE support a party that caters to supporters of Sedition that we watched live on TV and a 34 count FELON? A rapist?
Republicans never help working people or the environment because they cater to corporations. They gave now become full on Fascist supporters. The republican party is supporting a Fascist candidate.!
I’m afraid too. And I returned to the states and at the airport, I felt the fear and sadness.If been gone for 2 years. The people of this nation are in no way prepared for the chaos and loss that could be coming here. It’s way beyond stocking up on toilet paper snd bottled water… I hate fear.I hate what’s happening…
I have never felt this way about any election in this country. The problem is serious.
A-a-amen! The DNC has let us down this time more than ever before!!
They should quickly recruit Gretchen Whitmer and Elizabeth Warren!!! Or there are other great combinations of people as well to pull together for the convention!
A woman can’t win. This country isn’t yet ready. So dispel that one.
So glad someone else is saying this! It wouldn't matter how qualified she was either. She could be the most perfect candidate of all. But this country accepting a woman as our president is just not happening anytime soon! Even if Hillarys 'email situation' would not have came about, she wasn't going to win the electoral vote in '16 either. I well remember conversations with my dad during the '16 campaign. He could be abit of a misogynist so I was surprised he backed Hillary. I guess he did because he was well familiar with trumps true character as he was a long distance trucker and delivered many loads into NYC. in the 80s. I told him dad our country will not allow a female president. He turned to me on election night and said well you were right after all.
It’s sad but true. Not sure when we’ll be ready but there are plenty of women who won’t vote for or trust a woman’s competency to lead.
The same women who are ok with voting for a rapist who wants to take away their right to self determination.
Joe Biden suffers from Ruth Bader Ginsberg syndrome.
Yup, didn't know when to quit.
Exactly. The Dems need to pick a replacement STAT! If Biden had chosen and coached his successor during this term we wouldn’t have this problem. But, “better late than never.” Reviewing the debate is a waste of our time, we need to decide on a candidate and move on. Trump is not a permanent condition - life can change in a MOMENT!
Outstanding in the face of the MAGAmussolini's assault on the truth. I was especially disappointed in the lack of push-back by the so-called "moderators" for moderation is not something they did at all. Not allowing fact-checking was a huge blunder. Another thing about the "moderators" is their timing of the MAGAmussolini. He got five minutes more speaking time than Biden.
It is disturbingly obvious; they have become fascist stooges.
Major Garrett later did an abbreviated version of fact checking.
But it seems journalists in general, prefer controversy over dull as sawdust facts. I think it would have helped, had the President been dismissive, of the lying multiple felon, twice impeached, doc snatching sore LOSER.
Tonight Rachel Maddow capped her reporting on Biden’s poor performance with a review of the first debates of incumbent Presidents going back to the beginning. Every single one bombed his first debate. Most went on to win reelection. Yes, Biden’s performance was heartbreaking, but let’s not overreact!! The man who presided over the incredible list of legislative accomplishments Biden has delivered in his first term should not be counted out b/c of a bad night. Probably he had a fever in addition to the obvious cold. But in any case, this election is far from lost. There are steps the campaign should take to move forward in a positive way—and quickly. All of us who support the President can help. Don’t doom and gloom. Work harder!! Btw, despite the MAGA gloating, Trump absolutely lost on substance, despite his TV actor confidence. He lied repeatedly, and he failed to answer many questions. Supporters need to parse the former guy’s performance and get that info out there. Biden needs to own his flop and deliver a string of vigorous performances featuring himself as a man of honor and integrity with a viable and specific vision for the future. This night is more than salvageable; let’s do it!!
Thank you for this Beverly
Legislative accomplishments. Hmm.
All this is true but, in my opinion, beside the point. That point is that Joe Biden needed to save his campaign by giving the lie to all the statements and perceptions that he is an old man who can no longer do the job. Instead, he basically showed how true that is. It was a disaster. And here for me a mea culpa. To an earlier piece in this newsletter stressing fear that Joe Biden might come on in this debate as weak, I had thought that "no, Biden knows what is at stake, and will come out swinging as he has in his last two State of the Union speeches." How wrong I was. The debate was a catastrophe for him and the election will be for one for the Democratic party and more importantly, for the country if Joe Biden is the Democratic Party nominee for President, as looks certain to be the case at this point.
Dunno what universe everybody is in but it ain't mine. Biden focused on the questions and did refute #DonTheCon many times over. #Don could not even string two coherent sentences together. He rambled aimlessly and was clearly senile. #Don displayed a complete lack of focus and inability to control himself. Biden looked sick as a ghost but still focused and answered the questions intelligently.
Unfortunately body language and tone of voice affect listeners much more than content. This has been shown by psychological testing. 45 dominated the debate.
So we folks with speech problems are doomed. Maybe the next debate should not have any sound on--just closed captioning. That would get people right down to the content. I watched with captioning because of a hearing defect and I was very tuned in to policy and relevance. Biden did well in both of these areas, whereas Trump just rambled on nonsensically.
Ms. Billie, Can't refute you. Except to say that Biden's attempts to answer policy questions is what most of the electorate are NOT looking for. Most are looking for superhuman strength and that one person who can say 'I am the only one who can solve this.' Whether this statement is true or not is besides the point.
You are correct is your assessment. As a person with a speech problem (not the same one as Biden has), I know just how difficult it is to make an intelligent point and keep the listener engaged. I love Biden's policies and I loved his answers to the questions.
The answer for us is clear, we have to go out and vote a straight Blue ticket. We can’t let these criminals back in power. They are ruining our country.
My concern now, which was always in the back of my mind, is what we can expect from Biden 4 years from now...or even one, should he somehow win?? I'm not optimistic anymore, and it kills me to say so.
Even if he dropped dead the day he took office, the country would be well run by the people he has surrounded himself with.
We can expect him not to be alive anymore. That’s what people saw.
Why? Because he was battling a cold and looked like a ghost? While I think the makeup department could have done a better job, IMHO, the ghost is more alert and aware and relevet any day rather than the orange senile #DonTheCon.
I thought that, also.
Seems like tfg simply was gloating about his supporters backing him up, even had he failed miserably. Even though the media did catch him lying. INMO, the current President should have acted dismissive, rather than sincere. Sincerity and honesty are viewed by those of poor character, as weakness. And unfortunately, those of poor character, are the ones given all the hype.
He has to fight lies with biting insults and hyperbole. This debate is all about running the other side down.
He did say this to Trump: "You have the morals of an alley cat." That was the best line of the whole night.
We needed more of that.
Bill Clinton has the same morals as DJT and he elected twice. Supported by many of those in the comment section here.
Alas, too too true. The alternative was just terrible.
Yes. Life isn't fair. Step down biden
Biden is going to lose and 100% self imposed as hubris and lack of succession planning (like Hilary against trump and obama) for Biden and the DNC. He should have never run again.
Thats not true. Si he has a severe stutter. Ever watched the Kings soeech? Factual. Hevhas suffered from this his whole life
Calling him senile perpetuates the myth people who stutter are mentally defective. Its a language disorder. Its like making fun of someone with tourettes syndrome or on the autisn spectrum. Ive met joe biden and he is not senile. How is ge not different than king george? https://youtu.be/qvWRf4_ydCw?si=2mbKnAFfwWL1w536
King George only had to make a few speeches on the radio, not try to speak with a certified asshole.
Oh phoebe, i love the speach for the downtrodden, but we have an election we need to win. Take the lefty... be nice to people who stutter.... i get it, but we need to win an election. And I can't convince everyone to be nice as a strategy.
Are you going to tell every young and undecided voter to watch the kings speach? Great plan... she says sarcastically.