I can see the argument for insulating the Biden administration but, man, I am SO tired of see that evil man continue to walk free after all the damage he's done to our country. His treasonous actions, above all, should have taken him out of any Presidential, Congressional or any political race. He shouldn't even qualify as dogcatcher in our town! I am SO tired of waiting for justice to be served.
My "Other" choice is an 'all of the above' for today. I think the appointment of this special prosecutor is simply for an affirmation of the facts of the case.
"A big f 'n deal" would be an understatement on this one. It will take more time but the DOJ undoubtedly feels it must be done to insure that all of the information on ALL of the people involved is correct for indictments. It is no "dodge" by Merrick Garland, as some people seem to think, it's a testament to his desire to be thorough. The investigation is still in his hands, and will be to its end.
Personally, I'm in the "come on man, git it done" camp.
There is enough out there to indict the liar now, but the Justice Dept. is overly cautious because he is an ex-president. In a way it plays into the ex because he knows his own guilt and this gives him more time to squirm in the public eye, and that is what he wants, publicity. The one thing that will destroy the fake orange one is to be ignored. He is irrelevant already, but the press (including us) pays attention, making him continuously relevant like the local hog lagoon. So now the best choice (after delaying too long to do anything else) is to hire a quietly competent special prosecutor, do as much as you can without noise, and let the independent guy figure it out. Meanwhile the ex will likely hang himself in the absence of the fawning corrective publicity of Fox News (who are complicit in the crimes and should have a special prosecutor themselves) and, hope against hope, disappear.
Yes, more delays for trump to wiggle out of accountability. Crime, even compromising classified information, is okay, I guess. No problem to sell it. Or store it in my desk at home and work on it there. No indictment even on that case yet?????? Why and How is trump not sitting in jail awaiting judicial proceedings???
All of this has taken much too long. Appointing a Special Prosecutor will not change the perception of the MAGA madmen and women. Garland is dreaming if he thinks he can create the image of impartiality with Republican traitors.
That being said, Smith is a better choice to lead this project. He is EXTREMELY experienced and qualified. He is known to be entirely apolitical and very aggressive. Oh, and he wins big cases.
Robert & Heather, Thank you for these coffee klatch discussions and for providing this platform. For at least one day, let’s make it Thanksgiving…you must take the day off. Pretend you’re back in the olden days of 1985 when mobile phones were not a thing! Step away from the technology & keep your hands in the air!
Remember way back then? (Not you Heather…Not sure you were even around then😄)
The low hanging fruit -- like Giuliani, Navarro, who publicly admit guilt- Giuliani in open court at least 7 times -- Navarro in a friggin' book -- have not been indicted.
My dad was a lifetime prosecutor. He had to run for office, sometimes lost, and when he wasn't the official DA or ADA was appointed by the opposing party as a prosecutor under a state grant. In those days the attorney general didn't have statewide jurisdiction to prosecute so my dad was loaned to several district attorney's offices.
My dad's position was that if the police brought a case, he'd take it to the grand jury. It was up to them, not the prosecutor, to make the indictment. These days, prosecutors have the capacity to write an "information" starting a case.
On Jan 6, the acting US Attorney for DC, Trump appointee Michael Sherwin, went to the capitol, ostensibly as an observer. Soon he was removed, appeared on 60 Minutes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoAqWnD7NTI
In full disclosure, Sherwin once was married to my cousin. I have not spoken to either.
As of the date of his appointment Garland had notice that Sherwin should have been called as a material witness before a grand jury,
The jury is out in the Oathkeepers' trial. It's not over, but the tacit defense appears to be jury nullification. Jury nullification refers to a jury's knowing and deliberate rejection of the evidence or refusal to apply the law either because the jury wants to send a message about some social issue that is larger than the case itself, or because the result dictated by law is contrary to the jury's sense of justice or morality.
Apparently the "justice department" is more afraid of nullification than enforcing justice.
I was disappointed when I first heard the news, but hearing about Smith's history, maybe he is the one who can get it done. It may have been a good move on Garlands part. I do hope Trump faces the music for his crimes and gets that smug look off his face. I also hope the Republican party never recovers from supporting such a scourge of the earth.
Off the subject apologetically. I had been of the opinion Biden is too old to run again (I, at age 82 am a bit of an expert in this area) since if elected, Biden would be 86 at the end of his term. I am hopeful his wife will veto another Presidential run. The news yesterday of Biden administration giving a pass to MBS and the other Saudis for assassination and dismembering Kashoggi on the basis of Sovereign Immunity struck me as further evidence Biden should not run again. Recall the famous MBS/Biden fist bump photo and Biden then declaring Saudis would have consequences for stiffing the free world on his request for increased oil production to lower inflation and combat Russia war effort. Consequences? A declaration of immunity from a lawsuit by the Kashoggi bride-to-be? Outrage for this nondefense of embattled journalists the world over seems appropriate.
Felt much, much better after seeing/listening to Lawrence O'Donnell's program on MSNBC on Friday night. His interview with the 3 attorneys that are so knowledgeable about this prosecutor and the entire process we're about to enter.
I think the precedent setting first time a former president will be subjected to the full scope of the judicial system which may result in him being indicted; is fraught with peril, especially now that Trump has declared his candidacy for president in 2024.
At age 76, I well remember Nixon being pardoned by Gerald Ford after he resigned despite all the evidence pointing to his guilt. The prevailing wisdom at the time was that the danger of a criminal president had passed with Nixon's resignation and letting it go was the better option to heal the country. I always thought that the decision NOT to prosecute Nixon was likely part of a deal to get him to resign.
Whether that was the right choice or not is open to debate but I think it is likely that Trump's declaration pushed Garland to action although he seems to have insulated the Biden administration, the DOJ and himself somewhat by appointing a special prosecutor.
It was the same maneuver employed with the Watergate scandal and Nixon although, of course, Nixon was still in power and that led to the infamous Saturday Night Massacre when successive attorneys-general and a special prosecutors were fired. That scenario won't apply this time as the Biden administration wouldn’t touch the situation with a hundred foot pole.
Sometimes I think we nonlawyers forget how difficult it may be to get a jury to convict and an argument can be made for the Special Prosecutor for this reason. If Trump is indicted but not convicted, the rule of law may be permanently damaged. And Trumpists may act as though they are bulletproof. Garland said the Special Prosecutor will act without delay.
I’m trying to see the logic in Garland’s choice. I would feel better if this decision was announced on January 7. So now we can’t make him testify, we have had all these hearings and he is not yet indicted, the Republicans are about to take over and now Hunter Biden will be the total focus?
And we expect this will inspire our young people to vote?
Thank you, thank you, thank you. I came out of one of the most traumatic episodes of my life and found you and your writings. It’s complicated to write about, but simple to give thanks where it is deserved. Glad I have access to your constant communique. It’s worth the $.
I can see the argument for insulating the Biden administration but, man, I am SO tired of see that evil man continue to walk free after all the damage he's done to our country. His treasonous actions, above all, should have taken him out of any Presidential, Congressional or any political race. He shouldn't even qualify as dogcatcher in our town! I am SO tired of waiting for justice to be served.
My "Other" choice is an 'all of the above' for today. I think the appointment of this special prosecutor is simply for an affirmation of the facts of the case.
"A big f 'n deal" would be an understatement on this one. It will take more time but the DOJ undoubtedly feels it must be done to insure that all of the information on ALL of the people involved is correct for indictments. It is no "dodge" by Merrick Garland, as some people seem to think, it's a testament to his desire to be thorough. The investigation is still in his hands, and will be to its end.
Personally, I'm in the "come on man, git it done" camp.
High fives for Robert and Heather today.
Book ‘em Danno.
This former war crimes prosecutor should help defray any illusion of impropriety, especially since tRump has throw his mini mega cap in the ring.
There is enough out there to indict the liar now, but the Justice Dept. is overly cautious because he is an ex-president. In a way it plays into the ex because he knows his own guilt and this gives him more time to squirm in the public eye, and that is what he wants, publicity. The one thing that will destroy the fake orange one is to be ignored. He is irrelevant already, but the press (including us) pays attention, making him continuously relevant like the local hog lagoon. So now the best choice (after delaying too long to do anything else) is to hire a quietly competent special prosecutor, do as much as you can without noise, and let the independent guy figure it out. Meanwhile the ex will likely hang himself in the absence of the fawning corrective publicity of Fox News (who are complicit in the crimes and should have a special prosecutor themselves) and, hope against hope, disappear.
Yes, more delays for trump to wiggle out of accountability. Crime, even compromising classified information, is okay, I guess. No problem to sell it. Or store it in my desk at home and work on it there. No indictment even on that case yet?????? Why and How is trump not sitting in jail awaiting judicial proceedings???
All of this has taken much too long. Appointing a Special Prosecutor will not change the perception of the MAGA madmen and women. Garland is dreaming if he thinks he can create the image of impartiality with Republican traitors.
That being said, Smith is a better choice to lead this project. He is EXTREMELY experienced and qualified. He is known to be entirely apolitical and very aggressive. Oh, and he wins big cases.
Robert & Heather, Thank you for these coffee klatch discussions and for providing this platform. For at least one day, let’s make it Thanksgiving…you must take the day off. Pretend you’re back in the olden days of 1985 when mobile phones were not a thing! Step away from the technology & keep your hands in the air!
Remember way back then? (Not you Heather…Not sure you were even around then😄)
I believe AG Garland is playing chess while ‘the former guy’ is playing checkers.
I voted "other".
The low hanging fruit -- like Giuliani, Navarro, who publicly admit guilt- Giuliani in open court at least 7 times -- Navarro in a friggin' book -- have not been indicted.
My dad was a lifetime prosecutor. He had to run for office, sometimes lost, and when he wasn't the official DA or ADA was appointed by the opposing party as a prosecutor under a state grant. In those days the attorney general didn't have statewide jurisdiction to prosecute so my dad was loaned to several district attorney's offices.
My dad's position was that if the police brought a case, he'd take it to the grand jury. It was up to them, not the prosecutor, to make the indictment. These days, prosecutors have the capacity to write an "information" starting a case.
On Jan 6, the acting US Attorney for DC, Trump appointee Michael Sherwin, went to the capitol, ostensibly as an observer. Soon he was removed, appeared on 60 Minutes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoAqWnD7NTI
In full disclosure, Sherwin once was married to my cousin. I have not spoken to either.
As of the date of his appointment Garland had notice that Sherwin should have been called as a material witness before a grand jury,
The jury is out in the Oathkeepers' trial. It's not over, but the tacit defense appears to be jury nullification. Jury nullification refers to a jury's knowing and deliberate rejection of the evidence or refusal to apply the law either because the jury wants to send a message about some social issue that is larger than the case itself, or because the result dictated by law is contrary to the jury's sense of justice or morality.
Apparently the "justice department" is more afraid of nullification than enforcing justice.
I was disappointed when I first heard the news, but hearing about Smith's history, maybe he is the one who can get it done. It may have been a good move on Garlands part. I do hope Trump faces the music for his crimes and gets that smug look off his face. I also hope the Republican party never recovers from supporting such a scourge of the earth.
Off the subject apologetically. I had been of the opinion Biden is too old to run again (I, at age 82 am a bit of an expert in this area) since if elected, Biden would be 86 at the end of his term. I am hopeful his wife will veto another Presidential run. The news yesterday of Biden administration giving a pass to MBS and the other Saudis for assassination and dismembering Kashoggi on the basis of Sovereign Immunity struck me as further evidence Biden should not run again. Recall the famous MBS/Biden fist bump photo and Biden then declaring Saudis would have consequences for stiffing the free world on his request for increased oil production to lower inflation and combat Russia war effort. Consequences? A declaration of immunity from a lawsuit by the Kashoggi bride-to-be? Outrage for this nondefense of embattled journalists the world over seems appropriate.
Felt much, much better after seeing/listening to Lawrence O'Donnell's program on MSNBC on Friday night. His interview with the 3 attorneys that are so knowledgeable about this prosecutor and the entire process we're about to enter.
I think the precedent setting first time a former president will be subjected to the full scope of the judicial system which may result in him being indicted; is fraught with peril, especially now that Trump has declared his candidacy for president in 2024.
At age 76, I well remember Nixon being pardoned by Gerald Ford after he resigned despite all the evidence pointing to his guilt. The prevailing wisdom at the time was that the danger of a criminal president had passed with Nixon's resignation and letting it go was the better option to heal the country. I always thought that the decision NOT to prosecute Nixon was likely part of a deal to get him to resign.
Whether that was the right choice or not is open to debate but I think it is likely that Trump's declaration pushed Garland to action although he seems to have insulated the Biden administration, the DOJ and himself somewhat by appointing a special prosecutor.
It was the same maneuver employed with the Watergate scandal and Nixon although, of course, Nixon was still in power and that led to the infamous Saturday Night Massacre when successive attorneys-general and a special prosecutors were fired. That scenario won't apply this time as the Biden administration wouldn’t touch the situation with a hundred foot pole.
Sometimes I think we nonlawyers forget how difficult it may be to get a jury to convict and an argument can be made for the Special Prosecutor for this reason. If Trump is indicted but not convicted, the rule of law may be permanently damaged. And Trumpists may act as though they are bulletproof. Garland said the Special Prosecutor will act without delay.
I’m trying to see the logic in Garland’s choice. I would feel better if this decision was announced on January 7. So now we can’t make him testify, we have had all these hearings and he is not yet indicted, the Republicans are about to take over and now Hunter Biden will be the total focus?
And we expect this will inspire our young people to vote?
Thank you, thank you, thank you. I came out of one of the most traumatic episodes of my life and found you and your writings. It’s complicated to write about, but simple to give thanks where it is deserved. Glad I have access to your constant communique. It’s worth the $.