Rioters were carrying combat gear. This was clearly pre-planned and Trump multiple times primed his followers to come on January 6th and be prepared. He couldn't say publicly prepared for what but people don't show up in Washington DC in combat gear just for fun. Trump perpetuated a lie and convinced American people to fight like hell. Can you imagine any one of those insurrectionists actually leading our country? This country is in very serious trouble.
Obviously it was planned out far in advance - not only did we read/know about it from social media, but those people had to plan flying into DC from all around the country - during a pandemic with limited flights. Our local news (Spokane) right afterwards had a huge story breaking down the 6 insurrectionists from Idaho who have been prosecuted for Jan 6th with the photo evidence of each of them. I’m addition to leading to prosecution for tfg, I also hope these hearings make some of them realize they’ve been duped this whole time so they can take down their various maga flags.
this is an interesting comparison but Kristalnacht was a beginning warning of what would come if Jews did not escape before being worked to death or gassed to Death or starved to death or worked to death...So, one should never compare the Holocaust with anything...else because it. stood singularly alone and it still does..Even US slavery did not murder. 6 million men. women & children systematically as did the Nazis of 20th Century..Julie
There are a few instances of extermination of people that stand in a class by themselves. The entirety of Shoah is the symbol of the rest. One can reasonably exclude any comparison of part of the atrocity with something less horrific, I agree. But the great lie that Kristallnacht was spontaneous when it was planned by the evil leaders to appear as a popular uprising; that certainly resonates in the matter of the Capitol attack.
I think there are beginnings to riots.that includes back & forth discussions where they evolve with beliefs, information, opinions & mis-informations where some can take many steps up becoming more emotional & less sensible, greater involvement, more reaction & ends with less thinking about consequences.
Agreed. The mere fact that we wonder what the AG will do is a testament to how little the political establishment believes in the virtue of democracy. Shouldn't a president who conspired against the proper functioning of the institutions be indicted? Which planet do Americans live on?
An increasingly fascist one, it's beginning to look like. Ukraine is looking like a 'poster boy' for our future 'democracy'. Our president sends another $40 Bill for weapons with which to defend themselves, but where has the defense against domestic terrorists been? The ringleader has Secret Service protection! He should be cowering like Bin Laden in a hole!
A danger that comes with increased police defensive protection is that that miltary force could, under a different leadership, be used to establish and protect autocratic leaders. Coming hearings may reveal Trump's attempt to do that on January 6.
We need to be responsible for our republic and stop expecting to be taken care of. The best security for this nation is to create a thoughtful, truth-discerning, responsible, independent populace that values and is informed by thoughtful, truth-discerning, responsible, independent journalism.
We need to create an educational system that grows those values.
Currently the biggest thing taught in public education is passivity.
Amen! Totally agree. The lack of critical thinking among people paves the road to tyranny. One of the saddest things I came across in the United States is that so many will speak of "the government" as some foreign entity. I feel like shouting back to them "In a demo-cracy (people-rule) YOU are the government, idiots!" (Ooops! I just did)
Philippe ; It does not help to keep the public informed when cable gives the wrong times for the Jan 6th investigation hearings. Later in this thread I mentioned that my recording I scheduled of it on Thurs. June 9th was not there. In fact, there were no recordings of shows that day at any time.. I think it was intentional. They are in league with Fox.
In the 60's we used the National Guards to control riots. When Dr. Martin Luther King was assassinated, Federal Troops stationed around Washington D.C. were put on high alert just in case, they were needed to help the police. I know because I was stationed in Fort Meade about twenty miles away. We were not allowed to go anywhere off base just in case we were needed in D.C.
When Garland said some months ago that his main duty is to “protect the Dept. of Justice,” a red flag went up. Garland sounded like any other bureaucrat — like Mueller and Comey. But I hope I’m wrong.
Jami Murdoch ; At the very least, Garland and his family/loved ones could be under threat. tRump has been known to threaten people,(Stormy Daniels, his ex wife who had the audacity to file a complaint that he raped her and pulled her hair viciously while doing it), even 'wayward' Republicans. He is the ultimate mean control freak in America. Kind of like Putin in Russia. Don't look now, folks, but we are headed in a bad direction, unless we see REAL Justice!
If they are, Laurie, the FBI would be protecting him and investigating. I can’t imagine he’d let those kinds of threats stop him with all those resources to hand.
Thank you, Paula B. for the reassuring thought. At times I feel paranoid. Remember ; "Just because you're paranoid does not mean that you are not being followed". It is encouraging to think that there could still be some good people in our government who can actually do their jobs in a lawful way and protect people who should be protected.
Trying to “heart” you but my phone is being stubborn. I agree. I feel paranoid too, and for good reason. Of course Garland is the FBI’s boss (is that right?). They *should* listen to him.
I don't think Garland is a Trumper. But I don't understand why the low hanging fruit haven't been indicted. Lawyers who filed false affidavits, fake electors, etc.
The DC attorney general may have concurrent jurisdiction. In December, he filed a suit to hold the Proud Boys, Oath Keepers, and their leaders and members "accountable for their actions in planning and carrying out the January 6, 2021 attack and violating federal and District laws. It seeks to recover damages they caused to the District, particularly the physical, mental, and emotional injuries suffered by Metropolitan Police Department (MPD) officers."
It's possible all involved may be criminally responsible under DC law for the violence, including felony murder. http://dccode.org/simple-2012/22.html
DC is very peculiar in that most cases are prosecuted by the United States Attorneys' Office for the District of Columbia. This means that criminal cases are being prosecuted by federal prosecutors, even though prosecuted in DC Superior Court, which is not a federal court.
He's also known to run a tight ship... no leaks; doesn't interact with the press, detail-oriented, meticulous; aims to present air-tight cases which are usually successful. It may be that he's simply keeping his head down and working away on this. . . . But, it IS nerve-racking.
MM Harris ; The concerning thing is deja vu ; Remember The Mueller report that we all patiently waited for? Bob Mueller had sterling credentials and was known to be a no nonsense, scrupulous man who would not suffer fools gladly. Have the full facts ever been released to the public on that one? It's like it never happened.
"Thank you" bill barr for your role in shoving the Mueller report into the shadows, after lying about its content.... and now you're playing mr. innocent ("I told him it was bulls--t") Where were you in the very beginning, billy? You ditched your AG responsibilities to represent the USA ... in favor of supporting and protecting just a corrupt "president". And you continued doing so the entire time till rubber began hitting the road and you suddenly jumped ship and resigned. YOU are every bit the traitor the other sycophants & enablers are. YOU could have tried to stop the orange tyrant. Probably made every single decision with your eventual book in mind. You are only useful now because of the footage we have proving you told tfg the FACTS in the end, period. Yeah, that is now useful but it is NOT ENOUGH. Circling back to your first big coverup .. We can only hope the Mueller Report can now be released to show the truth.
MM Harris ; The Mueller report is valuable ; It is more evidence of his character and intent, even though some would argue that it is not germane to the present investigation. Also, I wonder who else it protects?
See my comments about the DC attorney general and the DC code.
E,G, A person commits the offense of aggravated assault if:
1. By any means, that person knowingly or purposely causes serious bodily injury to another person; or
2. Under circumstances manifesting extreme indifference to human life, that person intentionally or knowingly engages in conduct which creates a grave risk of serious bodily injury to another person, and thereby causes serious bodily injury.
b. Any person convicted of aggravated assault shall be fined not more than $10,000 or be imprisoned for not more than 10 years, or both.
c. Any person convicted of attempted aggravated assault shall be fined not more than $5,000 or be imprisoned for not more than 5 years, or both.
So it would seem, listening to the pundits that people are more worried about gas prices than losing our democracy. Take away: as long as gas is cheap we don’t care if we live in an autocracy, under a quasi despot. Really? That’s where we are? And the media is allowing the GOP to control this narrative and side step the central issue that Ms. Cheney so eloquently explained? Makes me sad and mad. Who are we?
We are living in a country that is so sold out that someone like tRump and a few of his friends in the Supreme Court (and other Federal courts0 can play the Justice Department like a steel guitar! The law is so weaponized by this corruption that we are paralyzed seemingly! Freedom of the press is just about gone! We need to clean out the Courts! We need to purge the Congress and Senate of all Seditionists!
Hope this mobilizes Democrats. We outnumber them. We need to concentrate on making sure that all potential Democrats are registered and vote accordingly.
Very true; however, even though mid-terms are notorious for low voter turnout, I would have thought that the primaries for this one would have been garnering MUCH MORE voting. Alas: in CA only 18% of registered voters turned out on June 7. That was appalling and terrifying! Hopefully more will vote in November.
It was disheartening but there wasn’t a big emotional issue on the ballot. Propositions A and B were snoozers for most people. But there’s a lot at stake in November and I hope people come out.
I know - I just don’t get how UNMOTIVATED people are about voting! It’s our lives! Laws and policies are what create our civil society and have power over how we live. What don’t people get about this? There are two glaring issues right now: guns and choice regarding abortion; no one can claim ignorance about these!
I'm amazed by how few really realize what's at stake right now..... and hope that maybe gun control and abortion choice will at least drive some to get more involved via those issues..
I would love to see term limits on EVERY government position. Congress, Scotus, every voted position, every appointed position. That would limit the power grabs and put new blood in our government - new ideas.
The problem with that is there is no continuity and institutional knowledge. Most of the appointees need 4 years to find out what the job actually is. By that time they've moved on.
It is not surprising that Fox News is afraid to show the truth to their undiscerning audience. And I wonder how many Americans took the time to watch and listen to the work done by the January 6 committee. Hopefully more than the number who show up at the polls when it's time to vote. The video of the insurrection was especially horrific when one remembers that these people are our fellow citizens and neighbors. My biggest fear is that the clock will run out before the Justice Department decides to prosecute Trump, et al. The next insurrection will not be so tame.
That insurrection was not "tame". I watched as it was happening. It was terrifying. I saw members of Congress, being herded into safety, I saw a Capitol building which I had the privilege to tour, being desecrated, I watched as a Capitol Police Officer was being crushed in a glass door by a smiling creep. I saw an officer being chased down a hall way and up some stairs by a gang of armed thugs. One thing I hope to learn from these hearing is why there were so few defenders at the Capitol, why wasn't the National Guard already on alert? why weren't police officers pulled in from Virginia and Maryland?
I, too, saw the entire thing. It made me sick on several levels. I had tears in my eyes in several instances (same during part of last night's footage). And my initial and continued question was also, "Where are the National Guard and other backup?" I knew right then that "somebody" had ensured there was NO backup. I hope this issue will be addressed in one of the hearings.
I remember shortly after the attack watching a news show on MSNBC ; There were allegations that Former National Security Advisor Michael Thomas Flynn's brother was giving orders concerning security and the Capitol police. Michael Flynn is a retired U.S. Army general who was the 25th U.S. National Security Advisor for the first 22 days of the tRump administration. He resigned in light of reports that he had lied regarding conversations with Sergey Kislayak.
And why is the 'Supreme' court surrounded by barriers, but the Capitol, the 'People's House' was not protected when most of the nation knew there was trouble afoot? tRump made it plain he was not going quietly. Someone is expecting 'unrest' at the court? Gee, I wonder why?
Fay, we all watched and it was indeed terrifying, but I didn't see anyone use a war weapon like was used on the children in Uvalde and Sandy Hook. By comparison, Jan 6 was tame.
I understand your point Jean. The murder of anyone is horrifying and of helpless children, more so. However, I still maintain the attack on the Capitol was not "tame". Police Officers did die, as did at least one woman (caught on video) I cannot compare the carnage in schools, but I have never before witnessed an attack on our Nation's Capitol. I wasn't alive in August of 1814, the last time our capitol was attacked and that was by a foreign nation (England) with whom we were at war, This was an unprovoked attack on the US Capitol by people who claim to be American citizens, instigated by a criminal, who happened to be the ex-president of our own Country. I know of no other incident that can compare.
Guy Reffitt, the first defendant involved in the January 6 insurrection to take his case to trial, found guilty on all five charges. Include obstructing a congressional proceeding and transporting firearms for unlawful use at a riot.
"In a cascade of texts, recorded conversations and video Zoom calls to his family, to fellow Three Percenters and to potential recruits, prosecutors tried to show that Reffitt led those behind him to defy police and break into the building. The government also tried to prove he was carrying a pistol at his hip and was hit repeatedly by rubber bullets and bear spray when he defied police.
“Multiple clay bullets and a battle cry like in Braveheart,” Reffitt wrote in one exchange. “The insurrection began immediately after.”
Jean, it's just not fair to say 1/6 was "tame" compared to the actions of two insane individuals at schools. The usage of "tame" does not apply to any of the 3 tragic, horriffic and pathetic events you noted. Insane actions are not the bar for what is, and what is not, "tame."
January 6 was far from tame. It was a deliberate, violent attempted coup. The Executive Branch and others carefully orchestrated actions to stop the Legislative Branch from performing a peaceful transition of power required by a civilized society and Democracy.
One can accuse me of being facetious when I used the word tame but I believe, from watching the 1/6 mob, that it very definitely contained people who are so violent in their nature they would not hesitate to use the AR's they probably own. By comparison...
Some were likely more violent than others, no doubt. But speculating on that is not helpful. The important take away is that ALL of the participants were radicalized by Fox and other media outlets because people believed that they were "under constant attack," and "their way of life was threatened" by Democrats.
Recently, on a "Christian radio station" in the Midwest, a program was clearly fermenting hate and violence against Pelosi and other Democrats with false narratives. It was very alarming, to say the least.
IMO, major misinformation by media outlets who perpetuated and validated "the big lie" must be addressed. Free speech is one thing... Yelling fire across the USA is another.
The irony is that these groups perpetuating misinformation could care less about climate change and fossil fuel dependency, the real reasons causing record fire seasons year after year across America. In fact, according to a USFS Representative, fire season is all year long now. Yet these irresponsible media outlets are making Biden and Pelosi out to be the reason America is burning. Go figure...
Danny, I have to disagree with you. I think speculating is a helpful part of critical thinking and in forming a plan or strategy for one's future. At the same time, I do agree with the remainder of your text; it's fair and true.
I may dislike EVERYTHING Liz Cheney stands for, but she chose AMERICA this day. I respect her for that. She is making me feel good about our chances of locking up, or AT LEAST forcing him out of politics, that morbidly obese, inhuman monster.
When she made that statement about how tfg will be gone but their dishonesty will remain, didn't she also add that "some are in this room" ??? I was looking for familiar orange gop in that room but didn't spot any. Anyone know who WAS in that room aside from witnesses and family members?
It’s been known for a long time that Trump is a master manipulator who emulates Mafia gangsters and knows how to keep himself safe while getting others to do his dirty work. If he gets away with this attempt at a coup, you can be sure he’ll run again in 2024 and America may find they have a dictator for President. I know this seems impossible, but history has a way of repeating itself.
Even if he DOESN'T run again, disantis and others of similar ilk are waiting in the wings....... (and I know some (non-Floridian) trumpers who have already dumped tfg in favor of disantis whose ego is big enough that even if tfg manages to run, he'll challenge him).) The coup continues!!! We cannot let up the fight against it.
Trying to “heart” your comment. DeSantis has taken tfg’s agenda even further. Some will like it but it’s got to alienate huge numbers of people. I think the key to fighting him is to get a charismatic Dem to run in 2024. Too bad Zelenskyy doesn’t qualify.
Are you referring to the hearings? Nearly all main tv channels carried it including msnbc, cnn, (and pbs?) (but not faux, unless you count faux business). The first (6/9) hearing appears to be on Youtube already; try this: . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=er8zUGr_ho8 ... Here are the remaining dates: (Times are all EST.) Mon, 6/13-10am.... Wed 6/15-10am.... Thu 6/16-10am.... Tue 6/21-10am....Thu 6/23-8pm.
I want to thank you once again for all of you information... I in fact did watch the tube version of this hearing as I missed it due to misinformation by the media. Thank you once again. Lynn
It still boggles my mind that most of the people involved in the insurrection are still loyal to Trump! When he was leaving office, he pardoned several people, but not one of them was an insurrectionist! Everyone is so loyal to him, but he never hesitates to throw those people under the bus. I will say, the people who believe in him and believe the election was stolen will not be swayed by these proceedings. Trump could come on TV and make a statement that he lost and he lied and these people will think they coerced him into saying those things. I don't know what he's done to his loyalists, but they don't give up. What I love is when my sister says she liked his policies and I say what ones. I still haven't gotten an answer.
Trump supporters are a very special breed, I think. They are the folks who are so grateful to Trump for all he's done but can't name a single thing he's done for them personally. They are the ones who believe that people are out there to destroy Trump and ruin him when, in fact, all he does is fling money at some of his supposed opponents and they will turn tail and run--with whatever he gives them. They are the folks who describe the war Officer Edwards described as something one prepares for in combat (and something she was not trained to handle) as a quiet visit to the Capitol; the same people who refuse vaccines from reputable pharmaceutical companies and opt for horse de-wormer; the same people who describe the peaceful demonstrations in front of St JOhn's Church and marches by BLM groups or in support of Roe v Wade as violent riots by anti-fa. The same folks who demean Dr Fauci and competent medical authorities; the same people who call VOldymyr Zelenskyy a thug; the same people who attack innocent Americans who are going about their ordinary lives in peace. The same people who cling on to every word Sean Hannity or Tucker Carlson or Laura Ingraham or MJT spew as the gospel truth. They are the people who meet Jordan Klepper at a rally and confide that they just love everything Trump says, when, in fact, they don't know or understand any of it. These people will not be persuaded by the truth, they will never accept that Trump is not the man they have created who does not exist. They have tied their entire selves to a 76-year-old toddler who has denied all responsibility but, at the same time, has decided that a job with the huge responsibility of answering for and to 330 million people is just the ticket for him. (He alone counts, to be sure)
The mind is an interesting and complex appendage. I like John Stuart Mill’s observation in “Utilitarianism,” teaching that a decision (like supporting Trump) is basically an algorithm. Like a teeter-totter, the decision of which end goes down is a function of which side has how many and what size weights and how the various weights are distributed. You can influence which side wins (a decision) by adding or subtracting a weight – or by moving a weight slightly.
I can understand how complex those weights and distribution are in people who would be convinced to vote for Trump. Factors include the desire for power or money [influencers (weights) like income/worth, spoiled bratness, addiction, etc.]; common sense [experiences, intelligence, susceptibility (gullibility, how many receipts they have for the Brooklyn Bridge), fear, mental health, etc.]; education [exposure, indoctrination, brainwashing, incapability of analytical thought]; and so on.
What I can’t get a handle on, though, is that group that would vote for Louis Gohmert! Gohmert has nothing on either end of the teeter-totter!
Steven Colbert inaccurately described him as the “dumbest man alive.” He’s not dumb – in fact he’s so stupid that he doesn’t have the sense to ACT dumb (never speak)!
I totally agree, but since he essentially gave them permission to drop being politically correct and embrace/preach their white nationalistic/ supremacy views w/o fear of being rejected by society. Learning from the Nazis, tfg just projects his own lies and ridicules anyone with and education/brain.
His main policy was destroy everything Obama did. He is such a racist he canmot stand that Obama even sat in the Wnite House, let alone accomplished things than were good for We the People. He was acting like a little child. But then, he never did grow up. He just kept getting older and older...
Wendy Nazel ; True, but I think tRump loyalists are a minority. The electoral college and the filibuster just makes them seem like their numbers are large. I have a brother who is a staunch Catholic and does not say much about what he likes about tRump. I really think it's abortion banning.
We also learned that the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers did not even go to the rally on the ellipse. By 10:30 am a filmmaker documented that these two groups were already headed to the Capitol to prepare for the breach of the building that held our legislators and the electoral college votes.
That documentarian was one of the committee's luckiest breaks. After tonight I have a little hope that by relentlessly revealing what happened in real time may have a strong enough effect that Garland will finally act. Even if Trump's minions do not fall in line, surely we can establish a few post holes to regain a little democratic footing.
Merrick Garland, I hope, will have already ordered the DOJ attorneys to begin preliminary preparation of the indictment to be ready to press charges the moment the Committee releases its final findings. I did watch the entire attack on Congress as it unfolded on January 6, 2021. I was on the phone with my friend in DC, whom I called to make sure he was in no danger. We watched the attack, while remaining on the phone. The most horrifying thing I heard at tonight's hearing was Officer Edwards trying to describe her experience slipping in fellow officers blood, seeing them, faces covered in blood, and vomiting from the poisonous sprays, the attackers used.
I saw her being interviewed before the hearing. Even though comments to the contrary during the hearing suggest otherwise, I think she is still working her former police position, while also working on a Masters degree. But she said she cannot get the "screams" from Jan. 6 out of her mind and certain things trigger ptsd. She said participating in the 6/9 hearing was hard to do but since so much is at stake, she felt obligated to do it. Tough cookie!
If Trump is unable to be held accountable in our current system of government, that will reflect what is already a broken democracy, if in deed it ever was not broken. That will call for a reexamination of who we were, who we are, and who we want to be in terms of being a "Democracy" that holds its powerful leaders accountable for their misdeeds.
I totally agree. But let's face it the American public is terribly uneducated about the workings of our government nevermind how to recreate ourselves in a fair democracy.
Agreed. AND, that would have to be included as part of the "recreating ourselves" paradigm, starting with, but not limited to, an adequate, if not ace, public education system! Hey, there's a concept! Go figure. Oh, yeah! Oops! It's that "States' Rights" thing. Drat. Why can't we just all think alike? Oh, yeah, that's part of the diversity thing. Drat.
Trump supporters will continue to deny the facts, however there is a growing number of them who have come to realize that they've been used. Right wing media is as culpable as Trump and his cohorts are, it's no wonder they're running scared, refusing to air the hearings and on the defensive. We're likely to see more text messages revealed indicating their involvement. As for Garland, my hope is after the committee provides him with all the evidence collected he will act and act quickly. I can't help but believe they've already given much of their findings to him already. Time is of the essence, he and those who participated and asked to be pardoned for their crimes against our nation need to be prosecuted now. Our democracy depends on it, I hope Attorney General Garland realizes this. Riveting night.
I seriously doubt that Jami, AG Garland is known for his methodical and disciplined approach to investigations. In this case I'm betting that he wants the strongest case that he can win before he acts. Let's hope the committee has provided him with everything he needs to do it very soon
Yes, the window for holding the former president,and his cohorts, accountable is rapidly closing. This committee must make the necessary recommendations expeditiously.
I do not believe that it is going to be possible to persuade any Trump supporter that The Big Lie is actually The Big Conspiracy. Those who swallowed the Trump poison cannot learn a thing from the Hearings because they have already made up their minds---for once and for all. I actually don't think the Hearings will cause many to change their views. The Trump led conspirators and clingers-on are going to hang with Trump till the end of their days. That is discouraging. Nothing I saw tonight terrified me as much as what one of the Trump supporters (a middle-aged white woman) said once they had made it into the Rotunda. caused damage, and carried their Stars-and-Baras Confederate flags, waving them in the air: "What do they want us to do now?" I felt like asking her and like-minded insurrectionists: "What do you mean by that, that you now don't know what you intended, what brought you to this point, that you were willing to destroy our Constitution, our government, our traditions and rule of law, even injure and kill those who are trying to carry out their duties and defend innocent people, and now you claim you need someone to tell you what to do?" If you had no plan beyond destruction and mayhem, if you don't care what you are leaving in your wake, if you don't have a leader (beyond a vague "they") what exactly are you doing here?" A recent lawyer interviewed on Brian T Cohen's program noted that the charge of seditious conspiracy or inciting an insurrection is far too lenient towards Trump, that, truth be told, the charge should be Treason. I expect it won't be and that, when all is said and done, Trump will waltz out of any criminal charges and end up free as a bird. It's hard to support the government when they are so fully in the pocket of the monied elite who will on occasion give us the illusion that we count.
I think the Hearings are very deliberate, very professional, very well-run, but that may not be enough to secure justice for the citizens of this country. Trump learned long ago (and from father Fred) that flinging money at any problem or offense or crime will take care of it and I expect he will just continue flinging away...to great effect and success.
Moving to prosecute is too slow! Trump was not smart enough to create a 7-step plan. Trump wanted the insurrection and different election results. Who really created the plan that he drove?
The fact that the hearing/s are being aired at all is a miracle and questions about the outcome are welcome. Considering the jeopardy our country was exposed to on January 6, viewing these hearings ought to be obligatory for all lawmakers and all indicted and unindicted co-conspirators. The likelihood is that many will still contest the facts.
I would like to add a sidebar comment, namely testimony by Officer Caroline Edwards indicates a pathetic lack of preparedness by those responsible for managing security. Insufficient guards, poorly prepared, even after it was obvious that there was an extraordinary assault in progress.
Unless correctives are put in place, how can we hope to do better next time? Especially when those who still support Trump are still at large and still easily able to acquire weapons.
It could be too optimistic to hope that lawmakers who helped in plotting the "insurrection" be held accountable - but that's not to say that a capitol which was otherwise closed to visitors for safety reasons ('COVID-19' precautions) should prove to be the object of multiple reports of strange visitors touring the day before the aforementioned event. Is there a Mike Nearman close to Congress (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_State_Capitol_breach)?
I think the subsequent hearings will address this... I saw evidence a few weeks ago that the DOJ was closing in on top level culprits. I think they got a lot of info out of proud boys and oathkeepers when they were being prosecuted.... roger stone was right in the middle of this. (When I was watching the actual insurrection, I saw him w/ a large group of proud boys right before they charged the capital. One pb asked him, "Is this really gonna go down?" and stone said, "Oh yeah.") I think DOJ has also got alot of info on mark meadows, who seemed to be command central. And in the hearing, it was mentioned more than once that "there is evidence that certain congressional members were leading private tours through the capital on Jan. 5" (I saw footage of some of that myself; I think greene was "leading" and at the time the point was that this was odd just from the standpoint that NO TOURS were allowed due to covid. She had a group of 5-6 people dressed in camo, I think even wearing red hats; they LOOKED like the thugs who barnstormed the capital the next day -- NOT family or your common tourist / picnicer.) And let's not forget that Cheney herself made a point (apx 2 mos ago?) that the committee had proof that tfg was heavily implicated in the insurrection, suggesting (to me anyway) that not only was she warning the general public, but had forwarded the proof to DOJ.
There was a headline on Yahoo! News saying AOC called out those lawmakers by name - essentially asking each point-blank whether they had solicited pardons from Trump on January 6th (suggesting some measure of forethought and/or thought about consequences); kinda sad, really: so many passionate sentiments regarding America... and yet such little spine (even the red/white/blue flags and garments were all made in China!)...
The term riot means something that had some spontaneity to it . This was a pre planned conspiracy to overthrow the elected government, not a riot.
Rioters were carrying combat gear. This was clearly pre-planned and Trump multiple times primed his followers to come on January 6th and be prepared. He couldn't say publicly prepared for what but people don't show up in Washington DC in combat gear just for fun. Trump perpetuated a lie and convinced American people to fight like hell. Can you imagine any one of those insurrectionists actually leading our country? This country is in very serious trouble.
There are still plenty of those people just waiting to try again. It is very scary.
You are so correct.!
Obviously it was planned out far in advance - not only did we read/know about it from social media, but those people had to plan flying into DC from all around the country - during a pandemic with limited flights. Our local news (Spokane) right afterwards had a huge story breaking down the 6 insurrectionists from Idaho who have been prosecuted for Jan 6th with the photo evidence of each of them. I’m addition to leading to prosecution for tfg, I also hope these hearings make some of them realize they’ve been duped this whole time so they can take down their various maga flags.
Yes, I like your background info...and your "hopes" for the results of the hearings..Julie
Kristallnacht. “Spontaneous mass uprisings” that were no such thing. Wasn’t there broken glass in both occasions? Kristallnacht Zweite.
this is an interesting comparison but Kristalnacht was a beginning warning of what would come if Jews did not escape before being worked to death or gassed to Death or starved to death or worked to death...So, one should never compare the Holocaust with anything...else because it. stood singularly alone and it still does..Even US slavery did not murder. 6 million men. women & children systematically as did the Nazis of 20th Century..Julie
There are a few instances of extermination of people that stand in a class by themselves. The entirety of Shoah is the symbol of the rest. One can reasonably exclude any comparison of part of the atrocity with something less horrific, I agree. But the great lie that Kristallnacht was spontaneous when it was planned by the evil leaders to appear as a popular uprising; that certainly resonates in the matter of the Capitol attack.
I think there are beginnings to riots.that includes back & forth discussions where they evolve with beliefs, information, opinions & mis-informations where some can take many steps up becoming more emotional & less sensible, greater involvement, more reaction & ends with less thinking about consequences.
Bob,
The key point in your analysis is your last one: what will AG Garland do? If the AG and DOJ fail to act, I am certain our democracy will be lost.
Agreed. The mere fact that we wonder what the AG will do is a testament to how little the political establishment believes in the virtue of democracy. Shouldn't a president who conspired against the proper functioning of the institutions be indicted? Which planet do Americans live on?
An increasingly fascist one, it's beginning to look like. Ukraine is looking like a 'poster boy' for our future 'democracy'. Our president sends another $40 Bill for weapons with which to defend themselves, but where has the defense against domestic terrorists been? The ringleader has Secret Service protection! He should be cowering like Bin Laden in a hole!
A danger that comes with increased police defensive protection is that that miltary force could, under a different leadership, be used to establish and protect autocratic leaders. Coming hearings may reveal Trump's attempt to do that on January 6.
We need to be responsible for our republic and stop expecting to be taken care of. The best security for this nation is to create a thoughtful, truth-discerning, responsible, independent populace that values and is informed by thoughtful, truth-discerning, responsible, independent journalism.
We need to create an educational system that grows those values.
Currently the biggest thing taught in public education is passivity.
Jeanne Mastriano ; Great ideas! But we are going to need to hurry just now. Merrick Garland and those in the Justice Department are you listening?
Amen! Totally agree. The lack of critical thinking among people paves the road to tyranny. One of the saddest things I came across in the United States is that so many will speak of "the government" as some foreign entity. I feel like shouting back to them "In a demo-cracy (people-rule) YOU are the government, idiots!" (Ooops! I just did)
Philippe ; It does not help to keep the public informed when cable gives the wrong times for the Jan 6th investigation hearings. Later in this thread I mentioned that my recording I scheduled of it on Thurs. June 9th was not there. In fact, there were no recordings of shows that day at any time.. I think it was intentional. They are in league with Fox.
It seems worth asking them directly.
In the 60's we used the National Guards to control riots. When Dr. Martin Luther King was assassinated, Federal Troops stationed around Washington D.C. were put on high alert just in case, they were needed to help the police. I know because I was stationed in Fort Meade about twenty miles away. We were not allowed to go anywhere off base just in case we were needed in D.C.
When Garland said some months ago that his main duty is to “protect the Dept. of Justice,” a red flag went up. Garland sounded like any other bureaucrat — like Mueller and Comey. But I hope I’m wrong.
Stan of Stanistan ; I hope so too.
to protect the Justice Dept. is a good thing but is it against protecting democracy? J/Stelton
I expected him to say that his main job is to protect the American people.
What's the chance that attorney general Garland is actually under Trump's spell?
Jami Murdoch ; At the very least, Garland and his family/loved ones could be under threat. tRump has been known to threaten people,(Stormy Daniels, his ex wife who had the audacity to file a complaint that he raped her and pulled her hair viciously while doing it), even 'wayward' Republicans. He is the ultimate mean control freak in America. Kind of like Putin in Russia. Don't look now, folks, but we are headed in a bad direction, unless we see REAL Justice!
If they are, Laurie, the FBI would be protecting him and investigating. I can’t imagine he’d let those kinds of threats stop him with all those resources to hand.
Thank you, Paula B. for the reassuring thought. At times I feel paranoid. Remember ; "Just because you're paranoid does not mean that you are not being followed". It is encouraging to think that there could still be some good people in our government who can actually do their jobs in a lawful way and protect people who should be protected.
Trying to “heart” you but my phone is being stubborn. I agree. I feel paranoid too, and for good reason. Of course Garland is the FBI’s boss (is that right?). They *should* listen to him.
Yay! it worked! Now that you hearted me, we can wish for real justice!
I don't think Garland is a Trumper. But I don't understand why the low hanging fruit haven't been indicted. Lawyers who filed false affidavits, fake electors, etc.
The DC attorney general may have concurrent jurisdiction. In December, he filed a suit to hold the Proud Boys, Oath Keepers, and their leaders and members "accountable for their actions in planning and carrying out the January 6, 2021 attack and violating federal and District laws. It seeks to recover damages they caused to the District, particularly the physical, mental, and emotional injuries suffered by Metropolitan Police Department (MPD) officers."
It's possible all involved may be criminally responsible under DC law for the violence, including felony murder. http://dccode.org/simple-2012/22.html
DC is very peculiar in that most cases are prosecuted by the United States Attorneys' Office for the District of Columbia. This means that criminal cases are being prosecuted by federal prosecutors, even though prosecuted in DC Superior Court, which is not a federal court.
You know for sure he is threatened by tRump cult
He's also known to run a tight ship... no leaks; doesn't interact with the press, detail-oriented, meticulous; aims to present air-tight cases which are usually successful. It may be that he's simply keeping his head down and working away on this. . . . But, it IS nerve-racking.
MM Harris ; The concerning thing is deja vu ; Remember The Mueller report that we all patiently waited for? Bob Mueller had sterling credentials and was known to be a no nonsense, scrupulous man who would not suffer fools gladly. Have the full facts ever been released to the public on that one? It's like it never happened.
"Thank you" bill barr for your role in shoving the Mueller report into the shadows, after lying about its content.... and now you're playing mr. innocent ("I told him it was bulls--t") Where were you in the very beginning, billy? You ditched your AG responsibilities to represent the USA ... in favor of supporting and protecting just a corrupt "president". And you continued doing so the entire time till rubber began hitting the road and you suddenly jumped ship and resigned. YOU are every bit the traitor the other sycophants & enablers are. YOU could have tried to stop the orange tyrant. Probably made every single decision with your eventual book in mind. You are only useful now because of the footage we have proving you told tfg the FACTS in the end, period. Yeah, that is now useful but it is NOT ENOUGH. Circling back to your first big coverup .. We can only hope the Mueller Report can now be released to show the truth.
MM Harris ; The Mueller report is valuable ; It is more evidence of his character and intent, even though some would argue that it is not germane to the present investigation. Also, I wonder who else it protects?
Robert, you are 100% correct.
The Democrats and the DOJ must ACT, or nothing will come of this.
See my comments about the DC attorney general and the DC code.
E,G, A person commits the offense of aggravated assault if:
1. By any means, that person knowingly or purposely causes serious bodily injury to another person; or
2. Under circumstances manifesting extreme indifference to human life, that person intentionally or knowingly engages in conduct which creates a grave risk of serious bodily injury to another person, and thereby causes serious bodily injury.
b. Any person convicted of aggravated assault shall be fined not more than $10,000 or be imprisoned for not more than 10 years, or both.
c. Any person convicted of attempted aggravated assault shall be fined not more than $5,000 or be imprisoned for not more than 5 years, or both.
Daniel Solomon ; The fines are almost laughable for this guy, but he has yet to be indicted. I wonder if he ever will.
Not just Trump. Thousands of potential defendants. If convicted can also lose all governmental benefits under a separate statute.
I wonder if we will see that?
So it would seem, listening to the pundits that people are more worried about gas prices than losing our democracy. Take away: as long as gas is cheap we don’t care if we live in an autocracy, under a quasi despot. Really? That’s where we are? And the media is allowing the GOP to control this narrative and side step the central issue that Ms. Cheney so eloquently explained? Makes me sad and mad. Who are we?
We are living in a country that is so sold out that someone like tRump and a few of his friends in the Supreme Court (and other Federal courts0 can play the Justice Department like a steel guitar! The law is so weaponized by this corruption that we are paralyzed seemingly! Freedom of the press is just about gone! We need to clean out the Courts! We need to purge the Congress and Senate of all Seditionists!
Hope this mobilizes Democrats. We outnumber them. We need to concentrate on making sure that all potential Democrats are registered and vote accordingly.
https://www.fieldteam6.org/
I write letters with Vote Forward…easy, on your own time…….it works! Check it out.
Very true; however, even though mid-terms are notorious for low voter turnout, I would have thought that the primaries for this one would have been garnering MUCH MORE voting. Alas: in CA only 18% of registered voters turned out on June 7. That was appalling and terrifying! Hopefully more will vote in November.
It was disheartening but there wasn’t a big emotional issue on the ballot. Propositions A and B were snoozers for most people. But there’s a lot at stake in November and I hope people come out.
I know - I just don’t get how UNMOTIVATED people are about voting! It’s our lives! Laws and policies are what create our civil society and have power over how we live. What don’t people get about this? There are two glaring issues right now: guns and choice regarding abortion; no one can claim ignorance about these!
I'm amazed by how few really realize what's at stake right now..... and hope that maybe gun control and abortion choice will at least drive some to get more involved via those issues..
I would love to see term limits on EVERY government position. Congress, Scotus, every voted position, every appointed position. That would limit the power grabs and put new blood in our government - new ideas.
The problem with that is there is no continuity and institutional knowledge. Most of the appointees need 4 years to find out what the job actually is. By that time they've moved on.
Excellent point. And there is no constitutional right to cheap gas.
It is not surprising that Fox News is afraid to show the truth to their undiscerning audience. And I wonder how many Americans took the time to watch and listen to the work done by the January 6 committee. Hopefully more than the number who show up at the polls when it's time to vote. The video of the insurrection was especially horrific when one remembers that these people are our fellow citizens and neighbors. My biggest fear is that the clock will run out before the Justice Department decides to prosecute Trump, et al. The next insurrection will not be so tame.
That insurrection was not "tame". I watched as it was happening. It was terrifying. I saw members of Congress, being herded into safety, I saw a Capitol building which I had the privilege to tour, being desecrated, I watched as a Capitol Police Officer was being crushed in a glass door by a smiling creep. I saw an officer being chased down a hall way and up some stairs by a gang of armed thugs. One thing I hope to learn from these hearing is why there were so few defenders at the Capitol, why wasn't the National Guard already on alert? why weren't police officers pulled in from Virginia and Maryland?
President Trump refused to call anyone in for help that's been a documented fact
I, too, saw the entire thing. It made me sick on several levels. I had tears in my eyes in several instances (same during part of last night's footage). And my initial and continued question was also, "Where are the National Guard and other backup?" I knew right then that "somebody" had ensured there was NO backup. I hope this issue will be addressed in one of the hearings.
I remember shortly after the attack watching a news show on MSNBC ; There were allegations that Former National Security Advisor Michael Thomas Flynn's brother was giving orders concerning security and the Capitol police. Michael Flynn is a retired U.S. Army general who was the 25th U.S. National Security Advisor for the first 22 days of the tRump administration. He resigned in light of reports that he had lied regarding conversations with Sergey Kislayak.
I remembered that too. What a complex and far-reaching bunch of accomplices...
He was pardoned by tRump, I believe.
Thank you, I certainly hope we get answers to these questions.
And why is the 'Supreme' court surrounded by barriers, but the Capitol, the 'People's House' was not protected when most of the nation knew there was trouble afoot? tRump made it plain he was not going quietly. Someone is expecting 'unrest' at the court? Gee, I wonder why?
Fay, we all watched and it was indeed terrifying, but I didn't see anyone use a war weapon like was used on the children in Uvalde and Sandy Hook. By comparison, Jan 6 was tame.
I understand your point Jean. The murder of anyone is horrifying and of helpless children, more so. However, I still maintain the attack on the Capitol was not "tame". Police Officers did die, as did at least one woman (caught on video) I cannot compare the carnage in schools, but I have never before witnessed an attack on our Nation's Capitol. I wasn't alive in August of 1814, the last time our capitol was attacked and that was by a foreign nation (England) with whom we were at war, This was an unprovoked attack on the US Capitol by people who claim to be American citizens, instigated by a criminal, who happened to be the ex-president of our own Country. I know of no other incident that can compare.
Guy Reffitt, the first defendant involved in the January 6 insurrection to take his case to trial, found guilty on all five charges. Include obstructing a congressional proceeding and transporting firearms for unlawful use at a riot.
"In a cascade of texts, recorded conversations and video Zoom calls to his family, to fellow Three Percenters and to potential recruits, prosecutors tried to show that Reffitt led those behind him to defy police and break into the building. The government also tried to prove he was carrying a pistol at his hip and was hit repeatedly by rubber bullets and bear spray when he defied police.
“Multiple clay bullets and a battle cry like in Braveheart,” Reffitt wrote in one exchange. “The insurrection began immediately after.”
The Capitol Police should have used real bullets, not rubber ones.
Jean, it's just not fair to say 1/6 was "tame" compared to the actions of two insane individuals at schools. The usage of "tame" does not apply to any of the 3 tragic, horriffic and pathetic events you noted. Insane actions are not the bar for what is, and what is not, "tame."
January 6 was far from tame. It was a deliberate, violent attempted coup. The Executive Branch and others carefully orchestrated actions to stop the Legislative Branch from performing a peaceful transition of power required by a civilized society and Democracy.
One can accuse me of being facetious when I used the word tame but I believe, from watching the 1/6 mob, that it very definitely contained people who are so violent in their nature they would not hesitate to use the AR's they probably own. By comparison...
Some were likely more violent than others, no doubt. But speculating on that is not helpful. The important take away is that ALL of the participants were radicalized by Fox and other media outlets because people believed that they were "under constant attack," and "their way of life was threatened" by Democrats.
Recently, on a "Christian radio station" in the Midwest, a program was clearly fermenting hate and violence against Pelosi and other Democrats with false narratives. It was very alarming, to say the least.
IMO, major misinformation by media outlets who perpetuated and validated "the big lie" must be addressed. Free speech is one thing... Yelling fire across the USA is another.
The irony is that these groups perpetuating misinformation could care less about climate change and fossil fuel dependency, the real reasons causing record fire seasons year after year across America. In fact, according to a USFS Representative, fire season is all year long now. Yet these irresponsible media outlets are making Biden and Pelosi out to be the reason America is burning. Go figure...
Danny, I have to disagree with you. I think speculating is a helpful part of critical thinking and in forming a plan or strategy for one's future. At the same time, I do agree with the remainder of your text; it's fair and true.
Probably no AR used Jan. 6 because they couldn't GET to anyone....
I have a good feeling about these prime time hearings!
I may dislike EVERYTHING Liz Cheney stands for, but she chose AMERICA this day. I respect her for that. She is making me feel good about our chances of locking up, or AT LEAST forcing him out of politics, that morbidly obese, inhuman monster.
Loved her dig about the rest of the spineless Repugs.
When she made that statement about how tfg will be gone but their dishonesty will remain, didn't she also add that "some are in this room" ??? I was looking for familiar orange gop in that room but didn't spot any. Anyone know who WAS in that room aside from witnesses and family members?
I do too! Doris Austerberry
... but the next one is at 10AM (on Monday?)
It’s been known for a long time that Trump is a master manipulator who emulates Mafia gangsters and knows how to keep himself safe while getting others to do his dirty work. If he gets away with this attempt at a coup, you can be sure he’ll run again in 2024 and America may find they have a dictator for President. I know this seems impossible, but history has a way of repeating itself.
This committee has a sacred duty to indict Trump.
DOJ has to indict.
Oops! Thanks for catching that. Hour was late!
Even if he DOESN'T run again, disantis and others of similar ilk are waiting in the wings....... (and I know some (non-Floridian) trumpers who have already dumped tfg in favor of disantis whose ego is big enough that even if tfg manages to run, he'll challenge him).) The coup continues!!! We cannot let up the fight against it.
Trying to “heart” your comment. DeSantis has taken tfg’s agenda even further. Some will like it but it’s got to alienate huge numbers of people. I think the key to fighting him is to get a charismatic Dem to run in 2024. Too bad Zelenskyy doesn’t qualify.
Paula B. He certainly is not wishy washy about Democracy though and is charismatic!
I think Zelenskyy is kind of busy.
It's hard to believe that DeSantis could get elected.
It was hard to believe that tfg got elected the first time...
It's at 10 am Eastern time, 7 am Pacific.
Thank you!
Good question
will you please tell me where and when you saw all this?
Are you referring to the hearings? Nearly all main tv channels carried it including msnbc, cnn, (and pbs?) (but not faux, unless you count faux business). The first (6/9) hearing appears to be on Youtube already; try this: . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=er8zUGr_ho8 ... Here are the remaining dates: (Times are all EST.) Mon, 6/13-10am.... Wed 6/15-10am.... Thu 6/16-10am.... Tue 6/21-10am....Thu 6/23-8pm.
I want to thank you once again for all of you information... I in fact did watch the tube version of this hearing as I missed it due to misinformation by the media. Thank you once again. Lynn
I think I got the time wrong ... thank you so much for responding
MM Harris ; Thanks for the info!
It still boggles my mind that most of the people involved in the insurrection are still loyal to Trump! When he was leaving office, he pardoned several people, but not one of them was an insurrectionist! Everyone is so loyal to him, but he never hesitates to throw those people under the bus. I will say, the people who believe in him and believe the election was stolen will not be swayed by these proceedings. Trump could come on TV and make a statement that he lost and he lied and these people will think they coerced him into saying those things. I don't know what he's done to his loyalists, but they don't give up. What I love is when my sister says she liked his policies and I say what ones. I still haven't gotten an answer.
Trump supporters are a very special breed, I think. They are the folks who are so grateful to Trump for all he's done but can't name a single thing he's done for them personally. They are the ones who believe that people are out there to destroy Trump and ruin him when, in fact, all he does is fling money at some of his supposed opponents and they will turn tail and run--with whatever he gives them. They are the folks who describe the war Officer Edwards described as something one prepares for in combat (and something she was not trained to handle) as a quiet visit to the Capitol; the same people who refuse vaccines from reputable pharmaceutical companies and opt for horse de-wormer; the same people who describe the peaceful demonstrations in front of St JOhn's Church and marches by BLM groups or in support of Roe v Wade as violent riots by anti-fa. The same folks who demean Dr Fauci and competent medical authorities; the same people who call VOldymyr Zelenskyy a thug; the same people who attack innocent Americans who are going about their ordinary lives in peace. The same people who cling on to every word Sean Hannity or Tucker Carlson or Laura Ingraham or MJT spew as the gospel truth. They are the people who meet Jordan Klepper at a rally and confide that they just love everything Trump says, when, in fact, they don't know or understand any of it. These people will not be persuaded by the truth, they will never accept that Trump is not the man they have created who does not exist. They have tied their entire selves to a 76-year-old toddler who has denied all responsibility but, at the same time, has decided that a job with the huge responsibility of answering for and to 330 million people is just the ticket for him. (He alone counts, to be sure)
You hit the nail on the head!
The mind is an interesting and complex appendage. I like John Stuart Mill’s observation in “Utilitarianism,” teaching that a decision (like supporting Trump) is basically an algorithm. Like a teeter-totter, the decision of which end goes down is a function of which side has how many and what size weights and how the various weights are distributed. You can influence which side wins (a decision) by adding or subtracting a weight – or by moving a weight slightly.
I can understand how complex those weights and distribution are in people who would be convinced to vote for Trump. Factors include the desire for power or money [influencers (weights) like income/worth, spoiled bratness, addiction, etc.]; common sense [experiences, intelligence, susceptibility (gullibility, how many receipts they have for the Brooklyn Bridge), fear, mental health, etc.]; education [exposure, indoctrination, brainwashing, incapability of analytical thought]; and so on.
What I can’t get a handle on, though, is that group that would vote for Louis Gohmert! Gohmert has nothing on either end of the teeter-totter!
Steven Colbert inaccurately described him as the “dumbest man alive.” He’s not dumb – in fact he’s so stupid that he doesn’t have the sense to ACT dumb (never speak)!
Sigh…
Excellent points...quite a few...or many...Julie
Nothing likable or charismatic about the guy to have such a cult-like following- beyond comprehension.
I totally agree, but since he essentially gave them permission to drop being politically correct and embrace/preach their white nationalistic/ supremacy views w/o fear of being rejected by society. Learning from the Nazis, tfg just projects his own lies and ridicules anyone with and education/brain.
He taps into the discontent and distrust of about 30% of the population, (including the greedy rich who he really works for).
EXACTLY: loyalty is a ONE-WAY STREET for that man-child! He flips in SECONDS, yet if you flip, you're a, "loser!"
His main policy was destroy everything Obama did. He is such a racist he canmot stand that Obama even sat in the Wnite House, let alone accomplished things than were good for We the People. He was acting like a little child. But then, he never did grow up. He just kept getting older and older...
Maybe he's gonna hafta really shoot someone on Times Square as the ultimate "loyalty test"?
Wendy Nazel ; True, but I think tRump loyalists are a minority. The electoral college and the filibuster just makes them seem like their numbers are large. I have a brother who is a staunch Catholic and does not say much about what he likes about tRump. I really think it's abortion banning.
He has no policies and he has no party.
We also learned that the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers did not even go to the rally on the ellipse. By 10:30 am a filmmaker documented that these two groups were already headed to the Capitol to prepare for the breach of the building that held our legislators and the electoral college votes.
That documentarian was one of the committee's luckiest breaks. After tonight I have a little hope that by relentlessly revealing what happened in real time may have a strong enough effect that Garland will finally act. Even if Trump's minions do not fall in line, surely we can establish a few post holes to regain a little democratic footing.
Have a lot of hope. Visualize.
I want to see that walk of shame with Enrique leading the way.
Merrick Garland, I hope, will have already ordered the DOJ attorneys to begin preliminary preparation of the indictment to be ready to press charges the moment the Committee releases its final findings. I did watch the entire attack on Congress as it unfolded on January 6, 2021. I was on the phone with my friend in DC, whom I called to make sure he was in no danger. We watched the attack, while remaining on the phone. The most horrifying thing I heard at tonight's hearing was Officer Edwards trying to describe her experience slipping in fellow officers blood, seeing them, faces covered in blood, and vomiting from the poisonous sprays, the attackers used.
Yes, her testimony stands out in what I heard tonight. I hope she's fully recovered.
I saw her being interviewed before the hearing. Even though comments to the contrary during the hearing suggest otherwise, I think she is still working her former police position, while also working on a Masters degree. But she said she cannot get the "screams" from Jan. 6 out of her mind and certain things trigger ptsd. She said participating in the 6/9 hearing was hard to do but since so much is at stake, she felt obligated to do it. Tough cookie!
Indeed!
If Trump is unable to be held accountable in our current system of government, that will reflect what is already a broken democracy, if in deed it ever was not broken. That will call for a reexamination of who we were, who we are, and who we want to be in terms of being a "Democracy" that holds its powerful leaders accountable for their misdeeds.
I totally agree. But let's face it the American public is terribly uneducated about the workings of our government nevermind how to recreate ourselves in a fair democracy.
Agreed. AND, that would have to be included as part of the "recreating ourselves" paradigm, starting with, but not limited to, an adequate, if not ace, public education system! Hey, there's a concept! Go figure. Oh, yeah! Oops! It's that "States' Rights" thing. Drat. Why can't we just all think alike? Oh, yeah, that's part of the diversity thing. Drat.
Maybe the price of democracy is Democracy. Didn't Socrates say something along those lines? Don't really know.
Trump supporters will continue to deny the facts, however there is a growing number of them who have come to realize that they've been used. Right wing media is as culpable as Trump and his cohorts are, it's no wonder they're running scared, refusing to air the hearings and on the defensive. We're likely to see more text messages revealed indicating their involvement. As for Garland, my hope is after the committee provides him with all the evidence collected he will act and act quickly. I can't help but believe they've already given much of their findings to him already. Time is of the essence, he and those who participated and asked to be pardoned for their crimes against our nation need to be prosecuted now. Our democracy depends on it, I hope Attorney General Garland realizes this. Riveting night.
I'm beginning to think attorney general Garland is actually in Trump's pocket
I seriously doubt that Jami, AG Garland is known for his methodical and disciplined approach to investigations. In this case I'm betting that he wants the strongest case that he can win before he acts. Let's hope the committee has provided him with everything he needs to do it very soon
Yes, the window for holding the former president,and his cohorts, accountable is rapidly closing. This committee must make the necessary recommendations expeditiously.
I do not believe that it is going to be possible to persuade any Trump supporter that The Big Lie is actually The Big Conspiracy. Those who swallowed the Trump poison cannot learn a thing from the Hearings because they have already made up their minds---for once and for all. I actually don't think the Hearings will cause many to change their views. The Trump led conspirators and clingers-on are going to hang with Trump till the end of their days. That is discouraging. Nothing I saw tonight terrified me as much as what one of the Trump supporters (a middle-aged white woman) said once they had made it into the Rotunda. caused damage, and carried their Stars-and-Baras Confederate flags, waving them in the air: "What do they want us to do now?" I felt like asking her and like-minded insurrectionists: "What do you mean by that, that you now don't know what you intended, what brought you to this point, that you were willing to destroy our Constitution, our government, our traditions and rule of law, even injure and kill those who are trying to carry out their duties and defend innocent people, and now you claim you need someone to tell you what to do?" If you had no plan beyond destruction and mayhem, if you don't care what you are leaving in your wake, if you don't have a leader (beyond a vague "they") what exactly are you doing here?" A recent lawyer interviewed on Brian T Cohen's program noted that the charge of seditious conspiracy or inciting an insurrection is far too lenient towards Trump, that, truth be told, the charge should be Treason. I expect it won't be and that, when all is said and done, Trump will waltz out of any criminal charges and end up free as a bird. It's hard to support the government when they are so fully in the pocket of the monied elite who will on occasion give us the illusion that we count.
I think the Hearings are very deliberate, very professional, very well-run, but that may not be enough to secure justice for the citizens of this country. Trump learned long ago (and from father Fred) that flinging money at any problem or offense or crime will take care of it and I expect he will just continue flinging away...to great effect and success.
I believe you are absolutely right but Trump is also in Putin's pocket so we are looking at no longer being a democracy.
To convince them, speak benefits. 99% of 100 have been personally screwed by Trump policies.
Moving to prosecute is too slow! Trump was not smart enough to create a 7-step plan. Trump wanted the insurrection and different election results. Who really created the plan that he drove?
I'm guessing bannon.
The fact that the hearing/s are being aired at all is a miracle and questions about the outcome are welcome. Considering the jeopardy our country was exposed to on January 6, viewing these hearings ought to be obligatory for all lawmakers and all indicted and unindicted co-conspirators. The likelihood is that many will still contest the facts.
I would like to add a sidebar comment, namely testimony by Officer Caroline Edwards indicates a pathetic lack of preparedness by those responsible for managing security. Insufficient guards, poorly prepared, even after it was obvious that there was an extraordinary assault in progress.
Unless correctives are put in place, how can we hope to do better next time? Especially when those who still support Trump are still at large and still easily able to acquire weapons.
I believe that "somebody" purposely ensured there was no police backup.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/gop-lawmakers-were-intimately-involved-in-jan-6-protest-planning-new-report-shows
It could be too optimistic to hope that lawmakers who helped in plotting the "insurrection" be held accountable - but that's not to say that a capitol which was otherwise closed to visitors for safety reasons ('COVID-19' precautions) should prove to be the object of multiple reports of strange visitors touring the day before the aforementioned event. Is there a Mike Nearman close to Congress (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_State_Capitol_breach)?
I think the subsequent hearings will address this... I saw evidence a few weeks ago that the DOJ was closing in on top level culprits. I think they got a lot of info out of proud boys and oathkeepers when they were being prosecuted.... roger stone was right in the middle of this. (When I was watching the actual insurrection, I saw him w/ a large group of proud boys right before they charged the capital. One pb asked him, "Is this really gonna go down?" and stone said, "Oh yeah.") I think DOJ has also got alot of info on mark meadows, who seemed to be command central. And in the hearing, it was mentioned more than once that "there is evidence that certain congressional members were leading private tours through the capital on Jan. 5" (I saw footage of some of that myself; I think greene was "leading" and at the time the point was that this was odd just from the standpoint that NO TOURS were allowed due to covid. She had a group of 5-6 people dressed in camo, I think even wearing red hats; they LOOKED like the thugs who barnstormed the capital the next day -- NOT family or your common tourist / picnicer.) And let's not forget that Cheney herself made a point (apx 2 mos ago?) that the committee had proof that tfg was heavily implicated in the insurrection, suggesting (to me anyway) that not only was she warning the general public, but had forwarded the proof to DOJ.
There was a headline on Yahoo! News saying AOC called out those lawmakers by name - essentially asking each point-blank whether they had solicited pardons from Trump on January 6th (suggesting some measure of forethought and/or thought about consequences); kinda sad, really: so many passionate sentiments regarding America... and yet such little spine (even the red/white/blue flags and garments were all made in China!)...
I saw that headline but haven't read yet; looking forward to reading it.